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That Guy
Registered: 08/12/08
Posts: 4,035
Loc: Southwestern US 
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 Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017  1
#823507 - 02/08/17 01:59 PM (7 years, 9 months ago) |
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Whats up guys and gals.
This is my first grow in quite a while, so I'm trying to keep things simple and sweet.
I chose Medibud becuase I have a high-stress job and have had on and off problems with insomnia for the last 2 decades. I wanted something that is simple, high yielding genetic potential (to hopefully offset the mistakes I know I'm going to make), and can help me relax and drift off to sleep after a long day at work.
I intend to start the seeds in a combo of FF Ocean Forest and generic seed starting soil in solo cups, then transfer them to 10 gallon fabric pots filled with primarily FF Ocean Forest. These will veg and flower in a 4x4x7 foot tent, which I will link to when I have fully set up.
I have high hopes for getting into more experimental grows that provide empirical data to back up my theoretical research (also found on the growery), but I need to get back into the swing of things for now. Medibud was a good choice to eventually support this work, as it is advertised as a particularly high-weight strain, and could provide an extreme gene expression datapoint for determining primary genes involved in overall yield (via qPCR and/or mRNA isolation and sequencing).
Anyway, let's begin...
Week 0:
I lightly scarified my Medibud seeds (4) on some emory paper and soaked in tap water for 8 hours. Once the seeds started to exhibit significantly reduced bouyancy, I transferred them to a damp paper towel in a plate, and covered both with another plate.
36 hours later...
I made my initial seedling pots with some red solo cups drilled through on the bottom and sides to provide both drainage and air exchange. I then fill them with FF Ocean Forest soil until about 3/4 to 4/5 full. I topped this off with some generic seedling starter soil.
I then made a small hole in the top soil surface of each cup, and gently (lifting by the seed coating) placed them into the hole with the root cap facing down, and the tip-top of the seed coating level with the soil. I then used my pen to gently push some soil in around the root and seed from the sides, and gently watered in the soil. To keep the humidity high and prevent drying of the soil, I placed some clear solo cups on top of the red solo cups.
     
This was yesterday, as of today, the cotyledons are peeking out of the soil, and they have been placed under moderately weak, diffuse LED light. I will slowly up the intensity throughout the week, and will transfer them to the tent for MH exposure next week.
I plan to update this post weekly. 
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Week 1:
I moved the seedlings under the 600W MH light, but I'm currently keeping the light high to prevent burning the leaves. Around the middle of the week, I cracked open the clear solo cups covering the seedlings to provide more air exchange. The soil is still moist 1/16" below the top of the soil, so I haven't watered the seedlings since I first popped them in the cups.
 
One of the seedlings looks a little sad, and I can't really figure out what is up with it, any ideas?
Thats it for now...more to come
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Week 2:
Not much to comment on at this point, so here's a few photos. The 2nd photo is the droopy plant from Week 1. Those leaves are still a little wierd, but she looks a lot happier.
 
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Week 3/4 Update (late)
Sorry for the delay, its been a busy few weeks. I ran into some trouble with my plants...
They were doing great until last thursday or so. Then they started drooping, and the lowest set of leaves began to turn yellow. It looks like a Nitrogen deficiency, but I was told by several sources that the Fox Farm Ocean Soil mix that I'm using is hot, and doesn't need nutes for about 8 weeks. I decided that it might be a sensitive strain (as hawks already pointed out) and was responding to being slightly rootbound. So I re-potted them into their final 10 gallon fabric pots. As you can see, the roots were through the soil, but not what I would consider root-bound.
The below photo was taken during the normal Friday Week 3 update. The leaves had perked up.
I figured they would need a couple of days to show signs of recovery. Unfortunately, as of today (middle of Week 4), the yellowing continues up from the bottom.
 
Now, I can't offer much detail to really pin down the problem right now. I plan on getting a soil testing kit tomorrow to see what the soil pH, and NPK ratios are. Other than that, I can tell you that I've been watering with a dilute kelp extract (using RO water) to encourage root development and reduce stress. I also know that my humidity in the tent runs way low (25-35% at all times, temperatures range from 70-80ish degrees F).
If anyone has any ideas, feel free to throw them out there. I've got some FF nutes on hot standby if need be, but I don't want to get too hasty before I know whats going on in the soil.
Updates to follow at Week 4 update 
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Week 4:
Thanks for the responses, guys. I think there were several different causes for the drooping and yellowing. The small cups of soil that I had them in initially were drying out very very quickly prior to transplanting...so there may have been some under-watering issues arising. Additionally, after testing the soil, the pH is ok at about 6.5-7.0, but the NPK is way off. Soluble N was nearly undetectable, Soluble P was medium-low, and Soluble K was medium.
I'm assuming that there might be some organic sources of the nutrients that aren't currently water soluble, and with proper symbionts may eventually be released for plant use. However, I need the nutrients now. So I took pyschotron's advice and foliar fed this morning (right before the lights came on) with a very dilute solution of FF GrowBig (6-4-4). And plan on watering with Growbig every other watering for a while along with my rooting inoculant to see how the plants react, and will foliar feed every few days, with at least one rinse spray a week to wash off excess salt buildup. They seem to have gotten through the worst of it, and appear to be responding positively to the nutrients.
They have several nodes now, and were starting to put out bottom branches, so I went ahead and topped them prior to taking photos. I also lowered the light a couple of inches, because the internode length seemed to be increasing since I had to raise the light to account for the larger pots. I probably set the light too high again. 
Anyway, here's some pics. Until next week
   
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Week 5:
Well, the advice worked out really nicely. The combination of bigger pots, a foliar spray with a little nitrogen, and a healthy root feeding at their last watering has really perked them up!
    
The are also recovering well from their topping last week. You can really see the side branches starting to develop. They are definitely ready for another watering, and I'm planning on doing another foliar spray tomorrow morning.
I'll probably start spreading out those branches next week, I only want another few inches of height before I start spreading them out into a screen.
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Week 6:
Well, not much to update on. They are getting bigger and bushier.
I decided to do a little training to spread out the foliage to encourage as many branches as possible, and to expose more of the large fan leaves under each branch to more light. Eventually, I'm going to put in a screen and try out my hand at scrogging, but for now I'm going to try and get these branches to grow as long as possible for the next week or two before the screen goes down.
So, should I attempt another topping to further develop the side branches and bush out the plants more? or should the main branches developing right now be enough for the SCROG?
Anyway, I also added an LED light bar that I had laying around. Its a 108W bar light cheapo special. I know its not really good for solo grows, and definitely no good for major lighting...but I figured it would help to brighten up some darker corners of the tent.
Thats all for now
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Week 7:
Sorry I'm a bit late, I've been super busy, and have started having some recurring lower back issues, so my work in the tent has been going a little slower. 
I kinda let the front two plants dry out a little too much at the time of the picture, I've since corrected the problem. I think this is because I've installed some watering rings around the bases of the plants, so that I can water and feed remotely using a 1/2 rubber tubing system. The rings are small, and I don't think they are getting the top outer edges of the cylinders of soil wet. Combined with the facts that the front 2 plants have a significantly larger canopy and are closer to the fan...its making it difficult to come up with an effective watering schedule right now. I'll keep a closer eye on them this week and try to get a hold back on this.
For a closer look, here are some individual pictures.
   
In order from left to right: Front right plant, front left plant, rear right plant, rear left plant.
It should be mentioned that between Week 5 and Week 6, I switched the front plants and the rear plants...because it appeared that the (then) rear plants were gaining some significant biomass on the front plants. Since these are all grown from seed, this may just be genetic variation or something...but I'll try to cover all of my bases until i bring the scrog screen down. At that point it shouldn't matter.
Also, I love my little loph sitting in the middle of the jungle 
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Week 9 (Skipped 8)
Psycho, I took your advice and decided to design my own little drain system.
First, here is a pic from Week 8, just for reference:
Now, I got some 21" drain pans, a few 2x6s, and some large plant caddies to support the weight. The 2x6s were used to shim the drain pans, in order to get a little bit of extra height. the split between the two boards allows for the downspout of the drain to hang below the drain pan.
  
I then tied 2 pans each into 2 common headers, pointed toward the space left between the 4 drain pan assemblies. This space is where the sump will be.
 
I used a small plastic mixing bucket for the sump. I installed 2 bulkheads opposite each other near the bottom of the bucket (with some silicone sealant around the gaskets to ensure a long lasting seal). I then installed a hi-lo sensor kit, which uses the water in the bucket to complete an extremely low voltage, low current circuit. You can see that I had to splice in a grounded plug in order to completely ground the full vertical length of the sump bucket (the bare wire provides this ground, which is necessary in order for the low level sensor to work properly). The hi-lo sensor is piggy-backed to a very small submersible pump. This pump turns on when the high-sensor is actuated, and pumps until the low-sensor turns off. This prevents over-cycling of the pump, and ensures that liquid in the sump can be pumped out of the tent into a 5-gallon bucket nearby.
  
I installed watering rings a few weeks ago in preparation for dropping the SCROG screen. I also recently cleared out the underside of the canopy to increase airflow in preparation for a thick canopy. These rings are tied by 1/2" black tubing to an external header, which allows me to fill an easily accessible reservoir outside of the tent, have a small submersible pump provide pressure/flow to the header, control the ultimate flow of the fluid via a common control valve, and then use the other 4 valves to merely direct the flow of fluid to each watering ring. This reduces the need for a hefty pump, and allows me to ensure that each plant gets its own share of water and nutrients. You can also see the drain line and bucket in these pics.
  
Finally, I dropped the SCROG frame in place, and sorta kinda worked the tops of the plants through. I used a system of zip ties in order to tension the screen on two sides, and just secured the other two sides, so the screen is pretty rigid. This made installation tricky, and ultimately some of the stems were scraped up a little. I think they'll survive though, its nothing catastrophic.
  
So there ya go. I think I'm going to give these ladies another 2-3 weeks in veg to fill out the canopy a little, then do a flush and start the transition into flowering
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Week 11:
These girls are filling out nicely now that the screen is down, I've got a small hole in the canopy on the back-right corner, but I should be able to shimmy some branches over there by week 11, and I'm pretty sure there are some smaller bottom branches currently trying to break through the last in or two to the screen.
It's been a steep learning curve figuring out the best way to maneuver those branches around the net without breaking the stems...and I've definitely bent some a little too much...but overall they seem to be doing well. I did find one major split in a trunk, and it looks like I need to get some heavier nitrogen on them, because they are still losing leaves below the canopy. I mixed up a strong (but not overly strong, I didn't want to quite hit the "heavy feeding" levels provided in the nutrient mixing instructions, but its stronger than I've been using) solution this morning and made sure to add some microbes to the mix, and made sure I got at least 10-20% runoff (which is super easy now that I've got a working water/drain system in place).
 
Quick question though, do I have too many lower branches? I noticed that there are at least 2 small branches per plant, that may not break through the canopy before they are shadowed out by larger branches. Should I chop them so that the plant can focus on the stuff thats already in the canopy, or just leave them be as extra bud sites that will eventually stretch into the canopy when I switch to flowering. I intend to make the switch in approximately 1 to 2 weeks, otherwise my canopy will be overrun. 
 
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Week 12: End of Veg
So, I have a mostly full canopy, at least 1-3 growth tips per 6" x 6" net opening, with some places being super dense and very difficult to fit any more growth down into the canopy. I'd like to fully fill in that back right corner, but the front left and right are starting to make me worry that I might have too many bud sites once flowering starts. Crowding may be an issue, but I'll deal with that when it happens.
 
I've cleared out any smaller branches that didn't make it up to the canopy, with the exception of a few that may stretch into some low-density canopy and help to fill everything in evenly. I also cleared out any yellow or brown leaves as best as I could reach, and did a final fold-down to make sure all growth tips are within 1-3 inches of each other, elevation-wise.
I'm currently flushing the soil, since I use a combo of chemical and organic stuff, and have been feeding heavily over the last few weeks. I started with a very slow trickle of 10 gallons of tap water + FF sledgehammer, and allowed that to drain/soak for about 30 minutes. I then followed up with 20 gallons of straight tap water (finishing that step up now), and then after draining stops, I will apply a starting mixture of FF Open Sesame and FF Bushdoctor Kangaroots, which I'm thinking will help add back any microbes that I either disturbed or flushed out (I'm not entirely sure if the sledgehammer detergents will cause the microbes to dislodge from whatever surface they are growing on, but I figured it wouldn't hurt anything).
I understand that this flush may be overkill and unnecessary, but I've always had issues with nutrient lockout on my previous grows, and want to make sure that I keep plenty of runoff flushing out of this grow to keep salt and metabolite buildup out of my flowering period.
I'll be running at least 24 hours of darkness starting this afternoon, and will be 12/12 for the next 10-12 weeks (according to the strain information). Feel free to comment, I'm all ears!
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Week 14 (Flower Week 2):
Hey Guys and Gals, I've been busy lately, and haven't posted in a bit.
I did manage to snag a pic of the canopy from Week 13:
And here is Week 14's pic:
I think the stretching is starting to level out, the hairs are really starting to show on some of the taller growth sites:
 
The canopy is a little uneven, but I simply don't have any room left to bend back down into the screen (a key mistake, I should have flowered earlier so that I would still have room). However, I don't think this will be much of a problem. It won't be perfect, but it will still produce good bud, and is much better than the canopy I would have had if I had attempted to flower those 4 monsters without screening them down.  
And THC, its exactly that, an automated water/drain system for a soil grow, it allows me to deliver water/nutrients and remove runoff without me having to heave things around, or crawl around under the canopy. So far, it works really well.
About 8 weeks left
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Week 15 (Flower Week 3):
Just a picture update for now.
   
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Week 16 (Flower Week 4):
  
Does anybody recognize what's going on in that last pic? Those dots are only showing up on one plant, which is getting fed and watered exactly the same as the others.
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Data said:
Week 18 (Flower Week 6):
   
I checked the flowering time last week and it's listed as 7-9 weeks. As such, I performed a flush, and will water with only filtered water for the next two weeks.
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Week 19 (Flower Week 7):
Last week before chopping, the leaves are starting to yellow, just gotta keep an eye on the amber/cloudy trichome ratio.
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Week 20 (Flower Week 8):
I'll be chopping sometime this week. The plants are pretty mature, and I managed to get one to purple pretty heavily just by dropping the temp in the house.
     
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Harvest:
  
Final bud harvest. I must admit that i converted most of the smaller or fluffy buds to chopped up trim for bubble hash.
The last picture is the foliage and popcorn buds that I still have to sift through.
I've been sampling the resin off of the clippers blades...and it's nice
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Final Numbers and Closing Thoughts:
Well, now that I've had a chance to get everything processed and dried, and gotten over my disappointment with the yield, I think its about time to wrap this grow log up.
So, out of a 4x4 foot tent, with a 600W HID, using a strain that was rated at up to 1200g/ft2, I harvested about 9 oz. of bud, and got about 13 grams of bubble hash from the trim. Half of the bubble hash (anything above 73 microns and below 45 microns) was stripped of solids via a cold ISO wash, an hour in the sun to break down the chlorophyll, and reduced to a nice oil that shatters into a billion pieces after sitting in the fridge for a bit.
Looking back on everything, I believe there are multiple avenues to this disappointing harvest.
- Not having an open area around the tent. Having the access to all corners of the tent would have allowed me to perform some of the necessary maintenance that needs to happen (all of which will be outlined soon).
- Having to rely on spray rings that were not wetting the entire soil volume, because i couldn't reach the soil with a sprayer.
- Not trimming back smaller branches, and not thinning out the canopy once I switched to 12/12. Less competing flowering branches and more light penetration would have probably increased the amount of harvestable bud.
- Initiating flowering too late. I allowed the SCROG canopy to completely fill the tent, and didn't allow room for training down the stretch growth. This also leads to:
- Uneven light distribution across the canopy, and possibly inadequate light in general. I never had issues with temperature, so I should have probably pushed up to a 1000W HID.
- Inadequate flowering time. I believe the rating online was 7-9 week flowering time, and I harvested around 8 weeks. Unfortunately, because of the situation with grad school and moving, I was really pushing the envelope at 8 weeks, so this aspect was actually out of my control for this grow. I think the plants could have stood another week or two.
- Given the shitty initial harvest, it would have probably been a good idea to trim the plants after harvest and re-vegging and flowering a 2nd time. Again, because of time constraints, I just was not able to do that.
So, that's it Because of the move, I'll probably not be able to do another grow for the next couple of years. Hopefully by then I'll be able to set up my growspace the right way, and get a pretty good yield next time.
 
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“The Universe is under no obligation to make sense to you” -NDT
Edited by Data (08/01/17 03:34 PM)
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Deadkndys420
Registered: 08/28/12
Posts: 8,703
Loc: █████
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 Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Data]
#823509 - 02/08/17 03:05 PM (7 years, 9 months ago) |
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 TrueHerbCrystal
Uncertified Oregrowian
Registered: 02/07/09
Posts: 1,352
Loc: Emerald City
Last seen: 6 years, 2 months
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Data]
#823515 - 02/09/17 01:30 AM (7 years, 9 months ago) |
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very nice.
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phychotron
Medicated
Registered: 02/17/11
Posts: 1,995
Loc: Earth (mostly)
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: TrueHerbCrystal]
#823545 - 02/09/17 04:25 PM (7 years, 9 months ago) |
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looks fun
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Any help given is for educational purposes only. Its your responsibility not to break any applicable laws
 Bamboo Bongs I make | Perfect Dry and Cure | Grapegod under LED
“Human beings, vegetables, or cosmic dust, we all dance to a mysterious tune intoned in the distance by an invisible player.” ~ Albert Einstein
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budgrowerwannabe
Bum fighter
Registered: 01/28/12
Posts: 3,360
Last seen: 3 years, 1 day
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: phychotron]
#823557 - 02/10/17 07:09 AM (7 years, 9 months ago) |
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looks like your off to a good start! Im subbed now 
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Data
That Guy
Registered: 08/12/08
Posts: 4,035
Loc: Southwestern US
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: budgrowerwannabe]
#823861 - 02/17/17 06:22 PM (7 years, 9 months ago) |
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Update for Week #1 can be found in the OP.
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“The Universe is under no obligation to make sense to you” -NDT
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Hawksresurrection
Registered: 12/04/08
Posts: 13,464
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Data]
#823864 - 02/17/17 07:46 PM (7 years, 9 months ago) |
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Those are stretching, I would get them closer to your light.
As far as the droopy one, how often have you been watering? What does the base of the stem look like?
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Dude she isn't as young as she use to be.
-niteowl
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Data
That Guy
Registered: 08/12/08
Posts: 4,035
Loc: Southwestern US
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Hawksresurrection]
#823866 - 02/17/17 08:14 PM (7 years, 9 months ago) |
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I dropped the light down to about 20" above the tops of the seedlings.
And I haven't watered since they went in the soil, but I've had them covered with clear cups as a makeshift humidity dome for a while. The soil is still moist below the surface, and the stem at and slightly below the soil surface is no different from the other seedlings. Should I be looking for something in particular?
Thanks for the quick advice!
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“The Universe is under no obligation to make sense to you” -NDT
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Hawksresurrection
Registered: 12/04/08
Posts: 13,464
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Data]
#823871 - 02/18/17 09:00 AM (7 years, 9 months ago) |
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I was just thinking that if you had been watering a lot you could be damping off.
But if you had just taken the cups off, you are probably dealing with a sensitive strain/pheno that is wilting from not hardening slowly enough.
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Dude she isn't as young as she use to be.
-niteowl
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Data
That Guy
Registered: 08/12/08
Posts: 4,035
Loc: Southwestern US
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Hawksresurrection]
#823873 - 02/18/17 09:45 AM (7 years, 9 months ago) |
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That makes sense, this strain is not known for high cannabinoid content, but does have some ridiculous potential for bud weight on a g/sq.m basis. It probably has been inbred a little too much.
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“The Universe is under no obligation to make sense to you” -NDT
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Stoneth
D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.
Registered: 10/06/08
Posts: 25,050
Loc: No where ville, USA
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Data]
#823875 - 02/18/17 12:31 PM (7 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
I've had them covered with clear cups as a makeshift humidity dome for a while.
Have you tried removing the clear cups yet?
I personally haven't used a humidity dome in years.
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Data
That Guy
Registered: 08/12/08
Posts: 4,035
Loc: Southwestern US
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Stoneth]
#823876 - 02/18/17 01:08 PM (7 years, 9 months ago) |
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Yea they are off now, and it looks like the leaves are perking up now that the soil is drying out.
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“The Universe is under no obligation to make sense to you” -NDT
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TrueHerbCrystal
Uncertified Oregrowian
Registered: 02/07/09
Posts: 1,352
Loc: Emerald City
Last seen: 6 years, 2 months
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Data]
#823898 - 02/19/17 07:53 AM (7 years, 9 months ago) |
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Could that sad seedling be heat-stressed from your intense lighting?
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Data
That Guy
Registered: 08/12/08
Posts: 4,035
Loc: Southwestern US
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: TrueHerbCrystal]
#823907 - 02/19/17 02:54 PM (7 years, 9 months ago) |
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I actually just checked, and now that the humidity domes are off and the light is dropped, the droopy one perked right up.
Unfortunately, they stretched a little too much and started to lean over, so I propped most of them up with some of that wire stuff wrapped in green foam that you can use to tie down tomatoes to their cages.
I gave them a little RO water, as the soil was completely dry, I added some kelp extract to the water. They look pretty good so far.
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“The Universe is under no obligation to make sense to you” -NDT
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phychotron
Medicated
Registered: 02/17/11
Posts: 1,995
Loc: Earth (mostly)
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Data]
#823925 - 02/19/17 06:00 PM (7 years, 9 months ago) |
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Get a small fan on it to strengthen the main stalk. Otherwise they will continue to stretch. Fans create super micro fractures as the thing swings back and forth and the plant has to 'repair' the damage. Its like pinching it back when its small like that.
If you stake them down real young you sorta cheat the thing form developing the strength it needs. They'll tend to stretch and rely on that stake instead.
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Any help given is for educational purposes only. Its your responsibility not to break any applicable laws
Bamboo Bongs I make | Perfect Dry and Cure | Grapegod under LED
“Human beings, vegetables, or cosmic dust, we all dance to a mysterious tune intoned in the distance by an invisible player.” ~ Albert Einstein
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TrueHerbCrystal
Uncertified Oregrowian
Registered: 02/07/09
Posts: 1,352
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Last seen: 6 years, 2 months
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: phychotron]
#823940 - 02/20/17 11:31 AM (7 years, 9 months ago) |
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How long should u "fan" your plants for? Do all strains need it?
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Data
That Guy
Registered: 08/12/08
Posts: 4,035
Loc: Southwestern US
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: TrueHerbCrystal] 2
#823941 - 02/20/17 01:05 PM (7 years, 9 months ago) |
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Im pretty sure an oscillating fan is pretty standard for a grow room. It helps to mechanically stimulate stem reinforcement, and keeps the air fairly well-mixed, ensuring that the plant surfaces are closed to air temperature rather than whatever equilibrium temp they reach with the light. Forced fresh air into the canopy can also discourage mold.
Someone feel free to correct me, but I'm pretty sure having one in the growroom for the entire grow is recommended.
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“The Universe is under no obligation to make sense to you” -NDT
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Hawksresurrection
Registered: 12/04/08
Posts: 13,464
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Data]
#823942 - 02/20/17 01:15 PM (7 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
Data said:
Im pretty sure an oscillating fan is pretty standard for a grow room. It helps to mechanically stimulate stem reinforcement, and keeps the air fairly well-mixed, ensuring that the plant surfaces are closed to air temperature rather than whatever equilibrium temp they reach with the light. Forced fresh air into the canopy can also discourage mold.
Someone feel free to correct me, but I'm pretty sure having one in the growroom for the entire grow is recommended.
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Dude she isn't as young as she use to be.
-niteowl
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phychotron
Medicated
Registered: 02/17/11
Posts: 1,995
Loc: Earth (mostly)
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Hawksresurrection]
#823967 - 02/20/17 10:19 PM (7 years, 9 months ago) |
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That and the area around the leaf gets void of CO2 within a minute or so. It cant grow without CO2 and has to wait for more to show up for it to be able to breath it in. I like to see all the plant leaves constantly shaking in the breeze.
For a small seedling like that I'd say a small oscillating fan would do the trick. If your fan is too strong you can get a smaller one or use a fan speed control to dial it down. You just gotta watch out for too strong of a wind on those seedlings, but it should be on constantly from here on out. Rotating them daily can help to, as it will balance out the effects of the wind at first.
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Any help given is for educational purposes only. Its your responsibility not to break any applicable laws
Bamboo Bongs I make | Perfect Dry and Cure | Grapegod under LED
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: phychotron]
#823982 - 02/21/17 06:33 PM (7 years, 9 months ago) |
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So I've got about 3 sets of true leaves now. I'm hoping to eventually SCROG these plants to fill in the space of my tent. When should I start thinking about topping the plant to encourage the bottom branches to develop? I'm trying to decide if it's better to top now and let the bottom 2 or 3 branch sets develop, or let the plants grow out a little more and LSTing the extra branches into place so that they are evenly space in the grow space?
Feel free to discuss or just post links, either way works for me.
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Hawksresurrection
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Data]
#823983 - 02/21/17 10:28 PM (7 years, 9 months ago) |
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Depends on how big they are, If it were me I wouldn't at just three weeks from germination. Let em grow a bit.
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Dude she isn't as young as she use to be.
-niteowl
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phychotron
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Hawksresurrection]
#823988 - 02/22/17 12:39 AM (7 years, 9 months ago) |
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I like to do it so that the lowest branches are as low to the ground as possible. Basically there is no need to fight gravity and you can have 'large plants' that are relatively short.
They end up being around a 5-12" tall when I top them. Seedlings are a little harder to top at first than clones, which tend to branch out from wherever the lowest node you left was.
From clones. Branching out as low as possible.
  
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phychotron
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: phychotron]
#823989 - 02/22/17 12:40 AM (7 years, 9 months ago) |
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Actually if you look at that photo in the center there's a ruler, seems to indicate I had them topped at around 3". Not advised with a seedling.
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phychotron
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: phychotron]
#823990 - 02/22/17 12:51 AM (7 years, 9 months ago) |
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Now that I'm thinking about it, here's my general guideline for topping seedlings. Look down on the plant and you'll notice the branches go in different directions. Some plants like to form +'s in the way they branch out, basically 4 main branches before they start stacking above each other on the main stalk. Other plants have more branches that come out at different angles, so as to have 8 branches before coming out in the same spot above another branch, i.e forming +'s and X's when looking straight down. Basically just look at the plant and determine if they are starting to overlap and top the one's that are. Keep the lowest 4 or 8 branches depending on which you have.
On the other hand some plants will not do anything with side branches when you top them. I just topped one that left all the side branches small and focused on the two top most branches. I just topped a bunch so I'll get some photos tomorrow or something.
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phychotron
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: phychotron]
#823991 - 02/22/17 01:11 AM (7 years, 9 months ago) |
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day 12 of veg of a clone, already topped, not sure when.
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: phychotron]
#824134 - 02/25/17 07:51 PM (7 years, 9 months ago) |
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Week 2 update in OP. 
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phychotron
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Data]
#824139 - 02/26/17 03:34 AM (7 years, 9 months ago) |
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You should post the update as a new post. Its easier to get updates, but also when you edit the post and something goes wrong on the boards you will loose your entire original post. Trust me, it sucks to loose an entire grow log. Once you get the new content secure on the forums you can go and edit the OP to include all the current info. Just copy the bbcode before you hit post and you can quickly paste it to the OP.
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“Human beings, vegetables, or cosmic dust, we all dance to a mysterious tune intoned in the distance by an invisible player.” ~ Albert Einstein
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phychotron
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: phychotron]
#824140 - 02/26/17 03:35 AM (7 years, 9 months ago) |
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and looking good btw.
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: phychotron]
#824141 - 02/26/17 05:29 AM (7 years, 9 months ago) |
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Will do mang, thanks for the tip
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Data]
#824526 - 03/08/17 06:58 PM (7 years, 8 months ago) |
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Week 3/4 Update (late)
Sorry for the delay, its been a busy few weeks. I ran into some trouble with my plants...
They were doing great until last thursday or so. Then they started drooping, and the lowest set of leaves began to turn yellow. It looks like a Nitrogen deficiency, but I was told by several sources that the Fox Farm Ocean Soil mix that I'm using is hot, and doesn't need nutes for about 8 weeks. I decided that it might be a sensitive strain (as hawks already pointed out) and was responding to being slightly rootbound. So I re-potted them into their final 10 gallon fabric pots. As you can see, the roots were through the soil, but not what I would consider root-bound.
The below photo was taken during the normal Friday Week 3 update. The leaves had perked up.
I figured they would need a couple of days to show signs of recovery. Unfortunately, as of today (middle of Week 4), the yellowing continues up from the bottom.
Now, I can't offer much detail to really pin down the problem right now. I plan on getting a soil testing kit tomorrow to see what the soil pH, and NPK ratios are. Other than that, I can tell you that I've been watering with a dilute kelp extract (using RO water) to encourage root development and reduce stress. I also know that my humidity in the tent runs way low (25-35% at all times, temperatures range from 70-80ish degrees F).
If anyone has any ideas, feel free to throw them out there. I've got some FF nutes on hot standby if need be, but I don't want to get too hasty before I know whats going on in the soil.
Updates to follow at Week 4 update
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Legalize
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Data]
#824538 - 03/09/17 05:30 AM (7 years, 8 months ago) |
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Over or under watering? I uses FFOF and can get some pretty big plants in 1 gallon pots without problems or nutes. My soil ph is 7. I water with ph 7 tap water.Using RO water alot of people seem to have the PH drop in FFOF. So definitely check that.
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budgrowerwannabe
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Legalize]
#824540 - 03/09/17 06:45 AM (7 years, 8 months ago) |
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Looks Like N def. to me? You might have got a weak batch of FF ? I would make a light feed for one plant and see what happens!
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phychotron
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: budgrowerwannabe]
#824543 - 03/09/17 08:20 AM (7 years, 8 months ago) |
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Everyone raves about FFOF but I hear a lot of issues from their stuff. Then I see these small plants with deficiencies from the go and I'm reminded why I don't use soil. If your not mixing it up yourself you have no idea how consistent the bag is from month to month.
Here's how FFOF typically goes down:
"heard it was great"
"heard it was hot"
"heard I don't need any nutrients till the end"
"heard I just needed some epsom salt"
"why are my plants dying after I watered them with epsom salt?"
Looks like a nitrogen deficiency. First I'd feed it some humic acid to try and boost the nutrient uptake, then maybe I'd foliar spray lightly with something like Humboldt Nutrients's Verde. It also has some Mg, iron, zinc and humic acid to help reduce common deficiencies.
Foliar sprays are great because your not cluttering up your root zone with stuff, and they require far less nutrients when absorbing them through the leaves.
I think the plant is growing faster than the soil can provide certain nutrients. Beneficial bacteria might help your situation.
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“Human beings, vegetables, or cosmic dust, we all dance to a mysterious tune intoned in the distance by an invisible player.” ~ Albert Einstein
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Theman
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: phychotron]
#824547 - 03/09/17 08:51 AM (7 years, 8 months ago) |
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Guys dont clutter ur root zone with stuff like nutrients. Lol
Trusted newbie
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phychotron
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Theman]
#824551 - 03/09/17 05:12 PM (7 years, 8 months ago) |
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When you have soil and you don't know the nutrient content and you add more your risking burning your plants, locking out nutrients or both. I prefer the KISS method, keeping the feed simple to prevent unneeded flushes that take more nutrients away and start you at another arbitrary point. Overfeeding then flushing is not the same as normal feeding without flushing.
Foliar sprays don't effect the root zone chemistry 
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: phychotron]
#824564 - 03/10/17 12:39 PM (7 years, 8 months ago) |
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Week 4:
Thanks for the responses, guys. I think there were several different causes for the drooping and yellowing. The small cups of soil that I had them in initially were drying out very very quickly prior to transplanting...so there may have been some under-watering issues arising. Additionally, after testing the soil, the pH is ok at about 6.5-7.0, but the NPK is way off. Soluble N was nearly undetectable, Soluble P was medium-low, and Soluble K was medium.
I'm assuming that there might be some organic sources of the nutrients that aren't currently water soluble, and with proper symbionts may eventually be released for plant use. However, I need the nutrients now. So I took pyschotron's advice and foliar fed this morning (right before the lights came on) with a very dilute solution of FF GrowBig (6-4-4). And plan on watering with Growbig every other watering for a while along with my rooting inoculant to see how the plants react, and will foliar feed every few days, with at least one rinse spray a week to wash off excess salt buildup. They seem to have gotten through the worst of it, and appear to be responding positively to the nutrients.
They have several nodes now, and were starting to put out bottom branches, so I went ahead and topped them prior to taking photos. I also lowered the light a couple of inches, because the internode length seemed to be increasing since I had to raise the light to account for the larger pots. I probably set the light too high again.
Anyway, here's some pics. Until next week
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Theman
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: phychotron]
#824568 - 03/10/17 02:12 PM (7 years, 8 months ago) |
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Quote:
phychotron said:
When you have soil and you don't know the nutrient content and you add more your risking burning your plants, locking out nutrients or both. I prefer the KISS method, keeping the feed simple to prevent unneeded flushes that take more nutrients away and start you at another arbitrary point. Overfeeding then flushing is not the same as normal feeding without flushing.
Foliar sprays don't effect the root zone chemistry
Lol ur making a case not to use soil now?? Dont ammend ur soil guys.haha
For newbs maybe but when u know plants u def want ro add things as needed to ur soil or xhange ur mix etc. Anyway, trust3d newb
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Theman]
#824573 - 03/10/17 03:18 PM (7 years, 8 months ago) |
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I mean, this is my first grow in 6 years or so, and my first soil grow in 8+ years....so yea I'll take some newb advice, I'm definitely out of the swing of things
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phychotron
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Theman]
#824581 - 03/10/17 06:43 PM (7 years, 8 months ago) |
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Quote:
Theman said:
Lol ur making a case not to use soil now?? Dont ammend ur soil guys.haha
For newbs maybe but when u know plants u def want ro add things as needed to ur soil or xhange ur mix etc. Anyway, trust3d newb
Most people who just buy a bag of "hot" soil don't know what to do with it other than stick a plant in it. At this point the OP can't amend the soil because there is a plant in there. He can only feed it. If he feeds said "hot" soil too early he's going to mess with the nutrients in the root zone that are readily available.
I never said you shouldn't feed your plants or not to use soil, just that foliar sprays are good for when you are uncertain of the nutrient content of your soil and you don't want to feed.
Stick around the forums for awhile and you'll see that the bulk majority of soil growers just expected to buy a bag of soil and call it good, maybe feeding at the end like they had heard.
I stick with my original assessment. Humic acid and microbes to boost nutrient availability.
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: phychotron]
#824878 - 03/17/17 09:19 PM (7 years, 8 months ago) |
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Week 5:
Well, the advice worked out really nicely. The combination of bigger pots, a foliar spray with a little nitrogen, and a healthy root feeding at their last watering has really perked them up!
The are also recovering well from their topping last week. You can really see the side branches starting to develop. They are definitely ready for another watering, and I'm planning on doing another foliar spray tomorrow morning.
I'll probably start spreading out those branches next week, I only want another few inches of height before I start spreading them out into a screen.
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budgrowerwannabe
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Data]
#824880 - 03/17/17 09:38 PM (7 years, 8 months ago) |
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Hell yea they are looking nice !! Good job 
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Stoneth
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: budgrowerwannabe]
#824882 - 03/17/17 10:37 PM (7 years, 8 months ago) |
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Be careful with the folar mixes, it's easy to burn the plants. Avoiding nitrate forums of nutes is wise. Highly recommend using some kelp and Fulvic acid about every 10 to 14 days. The branches will love you for it.
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TrueHerbCrystal
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Stoneth]
#824965 - 03/22/17 09:48 AM (7 years, 8 months ago) |
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Awesome pics 
Looking real healthy.
is that Basil in the middle?
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: TrueHerbCrystal]
#824968 - 03/22/17 10:59 AM (7 years, 8 months ago) |
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Haha yea it's a bit of lime basil that I'm holding over in the tent while the weather stabilizes.
And thanks for the tip, Stoney. I'm trying to keep my feedings substantial but lighter than full dosage, and staggering the root feedings and the foliar feedings. I'm also rinsing the leaves with RO water once a week to remove salt buildup.
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TrueHerbCrystal
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Data]
#824976 - 03/22/17 03:03 PM (7 years, 8 months ago) |
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How do u make RO water?
Is tap water or filtered water a bad idea?
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phychotron
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: TrueHerbCrystal] 1
#824985 - 03/23/17 02:29 AM (7 years, 8 months ago) |
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RO water is filtered water using a Reverse Osmosis filter. Some city water sources are crap and need to be filtered. Some just like to use it to be cautious.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/5-Stage-Home-Drinking-Reverse-Osmosis-System-PLUS-Extra-7-Express-Water-Filters-/271555919071?hash=item3f39fe7cdf:g:AuAAAOSw4A5YtJ0N
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: phychotron] 1
#824987 - 03/23/17 07:18 AM (7 years, 8 months ago) |
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I like to alternate between RO water and tap water, but that's because my tap water is very alkaline and has decent hardness. I have a little RO filter for my aquariums that I use.
The RO water is usually reserved for in/between feedings, foliar sprays, and rinse sprays. My theory is that water with no dissolved minerals is better able to pull out salt residue, so the RO watering usually involve watering until runoff is observed.
So far so good, the plants seem fat and happy...so I'll keep doing it until otherwise informed.
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TrueHerbCrystal
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Data]
#825011 - 03/23/17 10:49 PM (7 years, 8 months ago) |
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Fascinating
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Data
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: TrueHerbCrystal]
#825034 - 03/24/17 08:00 PM (7 years, 8 months ago) |
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Week 6:
Well, not much to update on. They are getting bigger and bushier.
I decided to do a little training to spread out the foliage to encourage as many branches as possible, and to expose more of the large fan leaves under each branch to more light. Eventually, I'm going to put in a screen and try out my hand at scrogging, but for now I'm going to try and get these branches to grow as long as possible for the next week or two before the screen goes down.
So, should I attempt another topping to further develop the side branches and bush out the plants more? or should the main branches developing right now be enough for the SCROG?
Anyway, I also added an LED light bar that I had laying around. Its a 108W bar light cheapo special. I know its not really good for solo grows, and definitely no good for major lighting...but I figured it would help to brighten up some darker corners of the tent.
Thats all for now
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Tetracan420
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Data]
#825038 - 03/24/17 08:39 PM (7 years, 8 months ago) |
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Apollo is a popular brand of tent, can't lie great deal I own one also
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Tetracan420]
#825206 - 04/02/17 03:32 PM (7 years, 7 months ago) |
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Week 7:
Sorry I'm a bit late, I've been super busy, and have started having some recurring lower back issues, so my work in the tent has been going a little slower.
I kinda let the front two plants dry out a little too much at the time of the picture, I've since corrected the problem. I think this is because I've installed some watering rings around the bases of the plants, so that I can water and feed remotely using a 1/2 rubber tubing system. The rings are small, and I don't think they are getting the top outer edges of the cylinders of soil wet. Combined with the facts that the front 2 plants have a significantly larger canopy and are closer to the fan...its making it difficult to come up with an effective watering schedule right now. I'll keep a closer eye on them this week and try to get a hold back on this.
For a closer look, here are some individual pictures.
In order from left to right: Front right plant, front left plant, rear right plant, rear left plant.
It should be mentioned that between Week 5 and Week 6, I switched the front plants and the rear plants...because it appeared that the (then) rear plants were gaining some significant biomass on the front plants. Since these are all grown from seed, this may just be genetic variation or something...but I'll try to cover all of my bases until i bring the scrog screen down. At that point it shouldn't matter.
Also, I love my little loph sitting in the middle of the jungle
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phychotron
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Data]
#825207 - 04/02/17 03:59 PM (7 years, 7 months ago) |
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Looking real nice and healthy
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: phychotron]
#825217 - 04/03/17 05:35 PM (7 years, 7 months ago) |
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Thanks man
Any idea what this crap is? I'm not sure if it's just a small scrape from some of the LST that I've been doing, or if it's something more serious.
For reference, I have only been root feeding and watering for the past week or two...and the leaves were sprayed with RO water after their last round of foliar feeding. Additionally, should the new shoots be that light compared to the older growth? I can never tell the difference between immature growth and the initial stages of immobile nute deficiency.
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phychotron
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Data]
#825219 - 04/03/17 09:03 PM (7 years, 7 months ago) |
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Looks like an iron deficiency at first glance. Iron turns to rust and is completely unavailable at around a pH of 8. Gauging by the few leaves that you can see with slightly burnt tips I'd say maybe the start of a lock-out type situation caused by pH.
Are you watering with enough runoff to flush the waste products the root zone produces?
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Any help given is for educational purposes only. Its your responsibility not to break any applicable laws
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“Human beings, vegetables, or cosmic dust, we all dance to a mysterious tune intoned in the distance by an invisible player.” ~ Albert Einstein
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Data
That Guy
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: phychotron]
#825222 - 04/04/17 02:02 AM (7 years, 7 months ago) |
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Probably not to be perfectly honest. I will make sure to do so during the next watering.
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“The Universe is under no obligation to make sense to you” -NDT
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funky
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Data]
#825256 - 04/06/17 11:45 AM (7 years, 7 months ago) |
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tagging along for bud porn. Looking good
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Data
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: funky]
#825257 - 04/06/17 11:57 AM (7 years, 7 months ago) |
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I finally came off the hip and purchased some drain equipment to handle runoff, I noticed the first time I had significant runoff that the water leaked through the tent liner, and I had to install an absorbent berm around the edge of the liner.
Before dropping the scrog net on top of the plants, I'm going to place them in 21" circular drain pans that will be raised up at least 2 or 3 inches, drilled and fitted with 1/2" drain tubing that will run into a common collection bucket for removal and dumping in the garden. This will allow me to safely run plenty of runoff with all of my watering from now on, and make the pre-flower flush much less terrible.
Will update with pictures later.
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phychotron
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Data]
#825260 - 04/06/17 02:36 PM (7 years, 7 months ago) |
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Good job. Handling runoff is something MOST people tend to overlook. When I first started growing I would take all my plants into the shower cause I didn't have an effective way to remove water. WAY too much work.
Depending on what drain hardware you have you'll probably need around 5" to do the plumbing. The bulk head sticks down about 2", T's and L another 2". 1" to connect them. Then the drain bucket needs to be lower so that it won't overflow when draining slow because of the multiple plants. When the water level in the drain bucket goes above the saucers its going to overflow.
I use a square bucket with a 3/4" drain fitting at the bottom that my trays connect to. Then I pump that out as needed. Ideally I'd have a "sump pump" type setup that automatically pumps it to the drain when it reaches a certain level, but its hard having all that in an apartment, and those pumps are pricey (for keeping a basement from flooding)
I built tables for lifting up my trays. 2x4's are real cheap, a saw and an impact driver and 2 1/2" wood screws will do you justice. They'll even cut the wood for you if you know your dimensions beforehand. Your not holding a roof on in a hurricane, so don't worry if its a little wonkey.
Build a square with legs essentially. Then add a few cross members if you have multiple trays to support. I just use the square with legs cause I use one big flood tray for runoff.
Then you can use a low-profile type tray underneath (for under beds and such) to catch your runoff with ease.
I have one that only has 4" of clearance under the lowest part of the wood, so the rest fits under, but I have to lift the whole table up to slide it under. I figure 9" would be best for accessibility in my veg tent. Flower tents are harder to find that height so an external bucket is a bit more appropriate for that.
Have fun figuring out a system that works for you.
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Any help given is for educational purposes only. Its your responsibility not to break any applicable laws
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“Human beings, vegetables, or cosmic dust, we all dance to a mysterious tune intoned in the distance by an invisible player.” ~ Albert Einstein
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Data
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: phychotron] 1
#825362 - 04/14/17 02:35 PM (7 years, 7 months ago) |
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Week 9 (Skipped 8)
Psycho, I took your advice and decided to design my own little drain system.
First, here is a pic from Week 8, just for reference:
Now, I got some 21" drain pans, a few 2x6s, and some large plant caddies to support the weight. The 2x6s were used to shim the drain pans, in order to get a little bit of extra height. the split between the two boards allows for the downspout of the drain to hang below the drain pan.
I then tied 2 pans each into 2 common headers, pointed toward the space left between the 4 drain pan assemblies. This space is where the sump will be.
I used a small plastic mixing bucket for the sump. I installed 2 bulkheads opposite each other near the bottom of the bucket (with some silicone sealant around the gaskets to ensure a long lasting seal). I then installed a hi-lo sensor kit, which uses the water in the bucket to complete an extremely low voltage, low current circuit. You can see that I had to splice in a grounded plug in order to completely ground the full vertical length of the sump bucket (the bare wire provides this ground, which is necessary in order for the low level sensor to work properly). The hi-lo sensor is piggy-backed to a very small submersible pump. This pump turns on when the high-sensor is actuated, and pumps until the low-sensor turns off. This prevents over-cycling of the pump, and ensures that liquid in the sump can be pumped out of the tent into a 5-gallon bucket nearby.
I installed watering rings a few weeks ago in preparation for dropping the SCROG screen. I also recently cleared out the underside of the canopy to increase airflow in preparation for a thick canopy. These rings are tied by 1/2" black tubing to an external header, which allows me to fill an easily accessible reservoir outside of the tent, have a small submersible pump provide pressure/flow to the header, control the ultimate flow of the fluid via a common control valve, and then use the other 4 valves to merely direct the flow of fluid to each watering ring. This reduces the need for a hefty pump, and allows me to ensure that each plant gets its own share of water and nutrients. You can also see the drain line and bucket in these pics.
Finally, I dropped the SCROG frame in place, and sorta kinda worked the tops of the plants through. I used a system of zip ties in order to tension the screen on two sides, and just secured the other two sides, so the screen is pretty rigid. This made installation tricky, and ultimately some of the stems were scraped up a little. I think they'll survive though, its nothing catastrophic.
So there ya go. I think I'm going to give these ladies another 2-3 weeks in veg to fill out the canopy a little, then do a flush and start the transition into flowering
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phychotron
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Data]
#825368 - 04/14/17 07:29 PM (7 years, 7 months ago) |
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Nice. Once you have drainage in place you'll never go without it.
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Any help given is for educational purposes only. Its your responsibility not to break any applicable laws
Bamboo Bongs I make | Perfect Dry and Cure | Grapegod under LED
“Human beings, vegetables, or cosmic dust, we all dance to a mysterious tune intoned in the distance by an invisible player.” ~ Albert Einstein
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Hawksresurrection
Registered: 12/04/08
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: phychotron]
#825379 - 04/16/17 12:10 AM (7 years, 7 months ago) |
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Are they showing sex?
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Dude she isn't as young as she use to be.
-niteowl
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Data
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Hawksresurrection]
#825380 - 04/16/17 06:48 AM (7 years, 7 months ago) |
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Well they were femonized seeds (supposedly), but yes they are all showing the occasional small calyx and associated silks or hairs. 
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Hawksresurrection
Registered: 12/04/08
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Data]
#825450 - 04/19/17 11:20 PM (7 years, 7 months ago) |
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Well that makes it easy. Out of the ten I germed one is for sure male, cut it down. Two look female, and the rest are lagging like a mother fucker. It's been like three months and most of em still aren't showing sex yet.
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Dude she isn't as young as she use to be.
-niteowl
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Data
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Hawksresurrection]
#825463 - 04/20/17 03:17 AM (7 years, 7 months ago) |
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Damn dude, that's gotta be frustrating 
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Data
That Guy
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Data]
#825523 - 04/21/17 10:21 AM (7 years, 7 months ago) |
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Week 11:
These girls are filling out nicely now that the screen is down, I've got a small hole in the canopy on the back-right corner, but I should be able to shimmy some branches over there by week 11, and I'm pretty sure there are some smaller bottom branches currently trying to break through the last in or two to the screen.
It's been a steep learning curve figuring out the best way to maneuver those branches around the net without breaking the stems...and I've definitely bent some a little too much...but overall they seem to be doing well. I did find one major split in a trunk, and it looks like I need to get some heavier nitrogen on them, because they are still losing leaves below the canopy. I mixed up a strong (but not overly strong, I didn't want to quite hit the "heavy feeding" levels provided in the nutrient mixing instructions, but its stronger than I've been using) solution this morning and made sure to add some microbes to the mix, and made sure I got at least 10-20% runoff (which is super easy now that I've got a working water/drain system in place).
Quick question though, do I have too many lower branches? I noticed that there are at least 2 small branches per plant, that may not break through the canopy before they are shadowed out by larger branches. Should I chop them so that the plant can focus on the stuff thats already in the canopy, or just leave them be as extra bud sites that will eventually stretch into the canopy when I switch to flowering. I intend to make the switch in approximately 1 to 2 weeks, otherwise my canopy will be overrun.
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“The Universe is under no obligation to make sense to you” -NDT
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Hawksresurrection
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Data]
#825615 - 04/27/17 03:13 PM (7 years, 7 months ago) |
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The leaves below the canopy are going to yellow and die, there just isn't enough light coming through for them to thrive.
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Dude she isn't as young as she use to be.
-niteowl
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Data
That Guy
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Hawksresurrection]
#825623 - 04/28/17 01:25 PM (7 years, 7 months ago) |
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Week 12: End of Veg
So, I have a mostly full canopy, at least 1-3 growth tips per 6" x 6" net opening, with some places being super dense and very difficult to fit any more growth down into the canopy. I'd like to fully fill in that back right corner, but the front left and right are starting to make me worry that I might have too many bud sites once flowering starts. Crowding may be an issue, but I'll deal with that when it happens.
I've cleared out any smaller branches that didn't make it up to the canopy, with the exception of a few that may stretch into some low-density canopy and help to fill everything in evenly. I also cleared out any yellow or brown leaves as best as I could reach, and did a final fold-down to make sure all growth tips are within 1-3 inches of each other, elevation-wise.
I'm currently flushing the soil, since I use a combo of chemical and organic stuff, and have been feeding heavily over the last few weeks. I started with a very slow trickle of 10 gallons of tap water + FF sledgehammer, and allowed that to drain/soak for about 30 minutes. I then followed up with 20 gallons of straight tap water (finishing that step up now), and then after draining stops, I will apply a starting mixture of FF Open Sesame and FF Bushdoctor Kangaroots, which I'm thinking will help add back any microbes that I either disturbed or flushed out (I'm not entirely sure if the sledgehammer detergents will cause the microbes to dislodge from whatever surface they are growing on, but I figured it wouldn't hurt anything).
I understand that this flush may be overkill and unnecessary, but I've always had issues with nutrient lockout on my previous grows, and want to make sure that I keep plenty of runoff flushing out of this grow to keep salt and metabolite buildup out of my flowering period.
I'll be running at least 24 hours of darkness starting this afternoon, and will be 12/12 for the next 10-12 weeks (according to the strain information). Feel free to comment, I'm all ears!
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TrueHerbCrystal
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Data]
#825776 - 05/05/17 04:44 PM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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Sweet system.
So it looks like an automated watering system for soil? Not a hydroponic?
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Data
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: TrueHerbCrystal] 1
#825883 - 05/13/17 04:34 PM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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Week 14 (Flower Week 2):
Hey Guys and Gals, I've been busy lately, and haven't posted in a bit.
I did manage to snag a pic of the canopy from Week 13:
And here is Week 14's pic:
I think the stretching is starting to level out, the hairs are really starting to show on some of the taller growth sites:
The canopy is a little uneven, but I simply don't have any room left to bend back down into the screen (a key mistake, I should have flowered earlier so that I would still have room). However, I don't think this will be much of a problem. It won't be perfect, but it will still produce good bud, and is much better than the canopy I would have had if I had attempted to flower those 4 monsters without screening them down.
And THC, its exactly that, an automated water/drain system for a soil grow, it allows me to deliver water/nutrients and remove runoff without me having to heave things around, or crawl around under the canopy. So far, it works really well.
About 8 weeks left
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TrueHerbCrystal
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Data]
#825951 - 05/19/17 12:33 AM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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Automated watering?
Thats badass. Merging hydroponic technology with old skool soil 
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Data
That Guy
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: TrueHerbCrystal]
#826000 - 05/22/17 08:06 PM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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Week 15 (Flower Week 3):
Just a picture update for now.
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“The Universe is under no obligation to make sense to you” -NDT
Edited by Data (05/22/17 08:07 PM)
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phychotron
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Data]
#826002 - 05/22/17 09:33 PM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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lookin nice and healthy.
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Any help given is for educational purposes only. Its your responsibility not to break any applicable laws
Bamboo Bongs I make | Perfect Dry and Cure | Grapegod under LED
“Human beings, vegetables, or cosmic dust, we all dance to a mysterious tune intoned in the distance by an invisible player.” ~ Albert Einstein
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Macky
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: phychotron]
#826052 - 05/25/17 08:17 AM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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Nice, got a serious jungle going on there
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Data
That Guy
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Data]
#826117 - 05/29/17 05:56 AM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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Week 16 (Flower Week 4):
Does anybody recognize what's going on in that last pic? Those dots are only showing up on one plant, which is getting fed and watered exactly the same as the others.
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phychotron
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Data]
#826122 - 05/29/17 09:50 AM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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Potasium or magnesium maybe. The second chart suggest manganese.
How many fans do you have below the canopy? That's thick and I'd think you'll get some PM if your not careful.
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Any help given is for educational purposes only. Its your responsibility not to break any applicable laws
Bamboo Bongs I make | Perfect Dry and Cure | Grapegod under LED
“Human beings, vegetables, or cosmic dust, we all dance to a mysterious tune intoned in the distance by an invisible player.” ~ Albert Einstein
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Theman
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: phychotron]
#826145 - 05/29/17 08:43 PM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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Mmm perhaps iron issue. Is it larger or smaller dry same as others?
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Data
That Guy
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Theman]
#826150 - 05/30/17 01:52 AM (7 years, 6 months ago) |
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Other than the spots on a few fan leaves, the same.
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“The Universe is under no obligation to make sense to you” -NDT
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Data
That Guy
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Data] 1
#826345 - 06/11/17 06:23 PM (7 years, 5 months ago) |
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Week 18 (Flower Week 6):
I checked the flowering time last week and it's listed as 7-9 weeks. As such, I performed a flush, and will water with only filtered water for the next two weeks.
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TrueHerbCrystal
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Data]
#826351 - 06/11/17 10:47 PM (7 years, 5 months ago) |
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Looking niiiiiice 
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Data
That Guy
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: TrueHerbCrystal]
#826528 - 06/18/17 07:23 PM (7 years, 5 months ago) |
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Week 19 (Flower Week 7):
Last week before chopping, the leaves are starting to yellow, just gotta keep an eye on the amber/cloudy trichome ratio.
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“The Universe is under no obligation to make sense to you” -NDT
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Data
That Guy
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Data]
#826782 - 06/25/17 06:02 PM (7 years, 5 months ago) |
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Week 20 (Flower Week 8):
I'll be chopping sometime this week. The plants are pretty mature, and I managed to get one to purple pretty heavily just by dropping the temp in the house.
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“The Universe is under no obligation to make sense to you” -NDT
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Macky
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Data]
#826793 - 06/26/17 03:17 PM (7 years, 5 months ago) |
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Is it me or has it been snowing in your grow room?
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Data
That Guy
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Macky]
#826795 - 06/26/17 08:13 PM (7 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Macky said:
Is it me or has it been snowing in your grow room?
Bud harvest off of the purple plant. I've pulled everything but the small popcorn on the bottom branches. I converted the larger popcorn to rough-cut trim in order to boost my future bubble-hash run. 
I'll pull the other plants in the next few days, transferring the bud into 1/2 gallon jars with boveda packs for curing as they reach the correct moisture content. Will update with pics, final bud weight, and bubble hash final product weights as they become available.
Cheers
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Data
That Guy
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Data]
#826857 - 06/29/17 06:51 PM (7 years, 5 months ago) |
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Final bud harvest. I must admit that i converted most of the smaller or fluffy buds to chopped up trim for bubble hash.
The last picture is the foliage and popcorn buds that I still have to sift through.
I've been sampling the resin off of the clippers blades...and it's nice
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Theman
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Data]
#826866 - 06/29/17 10:42 PM (7 years, 5 months ago) |
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If you used cheap wire hangers you cohld get the clips over the wire and clip stems. Instead of wrapping "good" hangers with wire. Just a thought
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funky
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Theman]
#826875 - 06/30/17 02:06 AM (7 years, 5 months ago) |
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Looks like a nice haul man.
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Data
That Guy
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Theman]
#826878 - 06/30/17 06:13 AM (7 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Theman said:
If you used cheap wire hangers you cohld get the clips over the wire and clip stems. Instead of wrapping "good" hangers with wire. Just a thought
I used what I had laying around.
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“The Universe is under no obligation to make sense to you” -NDT
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Theman
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Data]
#826890 - 06/30/17 12:09 PM (7 years, 5 months ago) |
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Just rich  lol
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Data
That Guy
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Theman]
#826893 - 06/30/17 01:37 PM (7 years, 5 months ago) |
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Yep, that's it 
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“The Universe is under no obligation to make sense to you” -NDT
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Data
That Guy
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Re: Indoor 600W HID Soil Medibud From Seed - Winter/Spring 2017 [Re: Data]
#827757 - 08/01/17 03:29 PM (7 years, 4 months ago) |
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Well, now that I've had a chance to get everything processed and dried, and gotten over my disappointment with the yield, I think its about time to wrap this grow log up.
So, out of a 4x4 foot tent, with a 600W HID, using a strain that was rated at up to 1200g/ft2, I harvested about 9 oz. of bud, and got about 13 grams of bubble hash from the trim. Half of the bubble hash (anything above 73 microns and below 45 microns) was stripped of solids via a cold ISO wash, an hour in the sun to break down the chlorophyll, and reduced to a nice oil that shatters into a billion pieces after sitting in the fridge for a bit.
Looking back on everything, I believe there are multiple avenues to this disappointing harvest.
- Not having an open area around the tent. Having the access to all corners of the tent would have allowed me to perform some of the necessary maintenance that needs to happen (all of which will be outlined soon).
- Having to rely on spray rings that were not wetting the entire soil volume, because i couldn't reach the soil with a sprayer.
- Not trimming back smaller branches, and not thinning out the canopy once I switched to 12/12. Less competing flowering branches and more light penetration would have probably increased the amount of harvestable bud.
- Initiating flowering too late. I allowed the SCROG canopy to completely fill the tent, and didn't allow room for training down the stretch growth. This also leads to:
- Uneven light distribution across the canopy, and possibly inadequate light in general. I never had issues with temperature, so I should have probably pushed up to a 1000W HID.
- Inadequate flowering time. I believe the rating online was 7-9 week flowering time, and I harvested around 8 weeks. Unfortunately, because of the situation with grad school and moving, I was really pushing the envelope at 8 weeks, so this aspect was actually out of my control for this grow. I think the plants could have stood another week or two.
- Given the shitty initial harvest, it would have probably been a good idea to trim the plants after harvest and re-vegging and flowering a 2nd time. Again, because of time constraints, I just was not able to do that.
So, that's it Because of the move, I'll probably not be able to do another grow for the next couple of years. Hopefully by then I'll be able to set up my growspace the right way, and get a pretty good yield next time.
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“The Universe is under no obligation to make sense to you” -NDT
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CLEAN AND EASY STB TEK
HOW I GROW MY SHROOMS
First Grow Journal
