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 DrGreenThumb
 
Registered: 08/09/08
Posts: 487
Loc: Phish Tour 
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 Re: Overdriven Shoplights!!! (Before you buy a T5 READ THIS)  [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#603033 - 12/27/11 11:54 AM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
OrgoneConclusion said:
If going backwards by reducing light and gaining heat is somehow desirable then go for it - but understand it.
Let me try to make this easy for you. The light on the left makes MORE light. The light on the right makes LESS light. Heat IS NOT an issue AT ALL!!!
Quote:
OrgoneConclusion said:
I flowered one tiny 12" plant with 15 watts and got 11 grams. Not earth-shaking, but everyone said 15 watts was too way too little to flower with.
You flowered a male dude. What did you get 11 grams of? Trash?
Quote:
OrgoneConclusion said:
Despite your numerous asides, you have failed to address the facts as I have stated them.
Wise man once said, "You can't argue with stupid. They'll beat you with experience every time."
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“Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.” -Dr. Seuss
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 OrgoneConclusion
Stranger
Registered: 05/06/11
Posts: 93
Last seen: 6 years, 10 months
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Re: Overdriven Shoplights!!! (Before you buy a T5 READ THIS) [Re: DrGreenThumb] 1
#603036 - 12/27/11 12:20 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
Let me try to make this easy for you. The light on the left makes MORE light. The light on the right makes LESS light.
Agreed. Never argued this point at all. Nice strawman. 
Does it make twice as much light? No. It makes 1.7 times as much while using twice the wattage. This is like writing an article titled 'How to turn $200 into $170'.
Quote:
Heat IS NOT an issue AT ALL!!!
(Using more than one exclamation point is never correct. It does not make your statement 3 times as valid.)
We are talking at cross purposes. You are stating that heat is not an issue for your particular grow space. Fine. This does not change the fact that the 15% light loss is expressed as heat.
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HempMaster
Space Trucker
Registered: 04/08/11
Posts: 253
Loc: Canada 
Last seen: 11 years, 5 months
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Re: Overdriven Shoplights!!! (Before you buy a T5 READ THIS) [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#603038 - 12/27/11 12:59 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
OrgoneConclusion said:
Quote:
Let me try to make this easy for you. The light on the left makes MORE light. The light on the right makes LESS light.
Agreed. Never argued this point at all. Nice strawman.
Does it make twice as much light? No. It makes 1.7 times as much while using twice the wattage. This is like writing an article titled 'How to turn $200 into $170'.
Quote:
Heat IS NOT an issue AT ALL!!!
(Using more than one exclamation point is never correct. It does not make your statement 3 times as valid.)
We are talking at cross purposes. You are stating that heat is not an issue for your particular grow space. Fine. This does not change the fact that the 15% light loss is expressed as heat.
no offense man but it sounds to me your trying way to hard to sound smarter than the owner of this thread, i should point out also that 1.7 times something is MORE than the original value, not less. So your example of turning $200 into $170 makes little sense in the way you expressed it.
while he may be using double the wattage to get 1.7 times brighter lights, the lights are brighter, whether he is using twice the wattage is a moot point as he was talking about over driving the bulbs and how to do it.
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My Tombstone will read: IwasburiedfacedownsoucanallkissmyA$$
my current grow
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OrgoneConclusion
Stranger
Registered: 05/06/11
Posts: 93
Last seen: 6 years, 10 months
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Re: Overdriven Shoplights!!! (Before you buy a T5 READ THIS) [Re: HempMaster] 1
#603054 - 12/27/11 02:47 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Smarter or stupider, the facts remain.
Take two light fixtures with bulbs with each putting out 5000 lumens (as an example) or 10,000 lumens total.
Gut one fixture to put the ballast in the other for a grand total of 8,500 lumens at the same power draw as the 10,000 lumens for a loss of 1,500 lumens less light to grow herb with.
I am beginning to understand the War on Drugs as this is third grade math.
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HempMaster
Space Trucker
Registered: 04/08/11
Posts: 253
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 11 years, 5 months
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Re: Overdriven Shoplights!!! (Before you buy a T5 READ THIS) [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#603063 - 12/27/11 04:06 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
OrgoneConclusion said:
Smarter or stupider, the facts remain.
Take two light fixtures with bulbs with each putting out 5000 lumens (as an example) or 10,000 lumens total.
Gut one fixture to put the ballast in the other for a grand total of 8,500 lumens at the same power draw as the 10,000 lumens for a loss of 1,500 lumens less light to grow herb with.
I am beginning to understand the War on Drugs as this is third grade math.
I understand what you mean but he has never been talking about actually using 2 fixtures, just one, with the extra parts from the second he gets an output increase from the single fixture. whys that so hard for you to grasp?
you might consider it a waste when both fixtures combined put out more lumens than a single modified one, but what if he doesn't have space to hang it, or has some other reason for only being able to use 1 fixture?
For someone who thinks their smart your really not that bright. This is 1st grade comprehension. As you should have considered this possibility before talking crap about what he's done.
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My Tombstone will read: IwasburiedfacedownsoucanallkissmyA$$
my current grow
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OrgoneConclusion
Stranger
Registered: 05/06/11
Posts: 93
Last seen: 6 years, 10 months
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Re: Overdriven Shoplights!!! (Before you buy a T5 READ THIS) [Re: HempMaster] 1
#603072 - 12/27/11 05:40 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
you might consider it a waste when both fixtures combined put out more lumens than a single modified one, but what if he doesn't have space to hang it, or has some other reason for only being able to use 1 fixture
Dear Mr. Reading Comprehension:
I already clearly stated this as a possibility; however you are to have me believe that there is a decent-sized audience for those who have a 48" * <12" grow space. Hell, I would wager the OP also does not fit in this non-existent category, but posted it mistakenly believing he was gaining something else.
I think it wrong-headed to steer others into an inferior method and you guys get upset that an engineer with many years in the industry points out the flaws.
I thought this forum was about education not applauding silliness.
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Stoneth
D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.
Registered: 10/06/08
Posts: 25,048
Loc: No where ville, USA
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Re: Overdriven Shoplights!!! (Before you buy a T5 READ THIS) [Re: HempMaster]
#603074 - 12/27/11 05:46 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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WOW what a thread.
OrgoneConclusion is talking facts.
It doesn't make much since to double the power of the bulb for less than 1/4 return in light. I agree with this.
Not saying that some such as the OP aren't getting what they feel they want from their light. Just wouldn't make me happy.
Why you ask? It's simple do the math, other than start up cost what point is there to overdrive the bulbs.
You take four overdriving bulbs at like 80 watt a piece which is 320 watts and they still don't match up to a 250 MH or HPS.
And that same 250 watt MH or HPS runs cooler.
However I understand not everyone has the money to start off HID lights.
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HempMaster
Space Trucker
Registered: 04/08/11
Posts: 253
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 11 years, 5 months
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Re: Overdriven Shoplights!!! (Before you buy a T5 READ THIS) [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#603076 - 12/27/11 05:55 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
OrgoneConclusion said:
Quote:
I thought this forum was about education not applauding silliness.
Well he is educating those who want to know how to over drive a single shop light fixture, though personally if i was going to do this i would just buy a single fixture and buy the second ballast at my local surplus electronics store, since its cheaper than buying another whole unit to just get the ballast.
But, everyone's entitled to their own opinion. I'm sure some will find this info useful.
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My Tombstone will read: IwasburiedfacedownsoucanallkissmyA$$
my current grow
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Alounacara
Born to be banned....
Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 6,621
Loc: Spicemaster, Texas
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 Re: Overdriven Shoplights!!! (Before you buy a T5 READ THIS) [Re: Stoneth]
#603133 - 12/27/11 10:33 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Here is a nicer better way of settling this argument..
I have to hang a few 4ft shop lights this week so i will have the covers off of several of them.
If the overdriven T8 light is on par with a the lumens produced by a T5 then maybe its better to go with a overdriven T8 bulb
#1 I will take an actual amp draw before and after said conversion
#2 I will see with my own eyes how much brighter an overdriven fixture is compared with a t5 ho 2 bulb fixture
#3 I have many years experiance with using flouros for just about any application
#4 I attended an ITT Industrial Electrical course back in `83 so i is very educatid
#5 I really think its probably better to upgrade your ballast to a HO rather than add an extra ballast. It probably cost only $10 more per ballast.
Your amp draw is very important also unless you live at home and mama is paying the electric bill
#6 Settle the fuck down and start acting like adults in here, this isnt the Thunderdome
Thanks in advance
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You never see a motorcycle parked outside a psychiatrist office
Texas is humongus compared to France
Our Gair, who art in Texas,
Paw Paw be thy Name..
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HempMaster
Space Trucker
Registered: 04/08/11
Posts: 253
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 11 years, 5 months
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Re: Overdriven Shoplights!!! (Before you buy a T5 READ THIS) [Re: Alounacara]
#603138 - 12/27/11 11:11 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
#6 Settle the fuck down and start acting like adults in here, this isnt the Thunderdome
Settle down? LOL Act like adults? LOL
Sorry i found that rather funny.
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My Tombstone will read: IwasburiedfacedownsoucanallkissmyA$$
my current grow
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OrgoneConclusion
Stranger
Registered: 05/06/11
Posts: 93
Last seen: 6 years, 10 months
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Re: Overdriven Shoplights!!! (Before you buy a T5 READ THIS) [Re: HempMaster]
#603143 - 12/27/11 11:59 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Yeah, where is the fun in that? 
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Alounacara
Born to be banned....
Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 6,621
Loc: Spicemaster, Texas
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Re: Overdriven Shoplights!!! (Before you buy a T5 READ THIS) [Re: OrgoneConclusion] 1
#603146 - 12/28/11 12:34 AM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Being our bigshot electrical engineer made me think that maybe you knew what the fuck you were talking about?
I guess i was wrong in that assumption
What it all adds up to is amp draw vs lumens
Its important to me because i am fixing to purchase a 6 or 8 bulb T5 HO fixture for sproating young plants.
If by chance i can simply add another ballast using T8 bulbs and get the same or better lumens than the T5`s then your argument is just a bunch of crap.
What it all boils down to is if you dont experiment with it and actually put your eyes and amp probe on it then you you are just a slack jaw idiot.
Typing big words on this forum just makes me do the happy ha has
You guys fight worse than 15 yr old boys at a salt n pepper dance
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You never see a motorcycle parked outside a psychiatrist office
Texas is humongus compared to France
Our Gair, who art in Texas,
Paw Paw be thy Name..
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DrGreenThumb
Registered: 08/09/08
Posts: 487
Loc: Phish Tour
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Re: Overdriven Shoplights!!! (Before you buy a T5 READ THIS) [Re: Stoneth] 1
#603158 - 12/28/11 07:25 AM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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You still don't get it do you?
What it boils down to is LUMENS PER FOOT.
Is this shop light BRIGHTER than that shop light? YES.
This means that the light is also more INTENSE which means shorter internode spacing and faster GROWTH.
My veg closet is 3 shoplights wide. I couldn't fit 6 shoplights in there. Even is I could, the light would be more spread out = less intense.
Quote:
Stoneth said:
It doesn't make much since to double the power of the bulb for less than 1/4 return in light. I agree with this.
Orgone already stated that I was ONLY getting 1.7X the amount of light. That equals 70% more light, not 1/4 more light, which would be 25%.
That being said, I could really give two shits whether or not I'm losing a little efficiency. The fact remains that I gain much more light.
I'm trying to keep a 2000W flowering room fed with plants in the space I have to work with. This does it VERY WELL. An extra $10 on my power bill is the least of my problems. If I was trying to SAVE electricity I wouldn't be Overdriving my lights. Get it?
As far as a 250W HPS running cooler? It doesn't. I tried.
Put a 250W in this closet and the temps rise to unacceptable levels, even with a fan. Plus you have to keep it RAISED to get any sort of coverage. This makes for longer internode spacing which is the opposite of what I am trying to achieve. I can run 3 OD shoplights in the same closet WITHOUT a fan, right on top of the plants, and cover the whole closet.
I see how this is can be confusing for an electrical engineer who has a 3 Watt flowering room. Some of us are trying to grow weed here. I'd love to stay and chat but the lights just came on and I have girls to tend too.
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“Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.” -Dr. Seuss
Edited by DrGreenThumb (12/28/11 10:28 AM)
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HempMaster
Space Trucker
Registered: 04/08/11
Posts: 253
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 11 years, 5 months
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Re: Overdriven Shoplights!!! (Before you buy a T5 READ THIS) [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#603183 - 12/28/11 02:19 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
OrgoneConclusion said:
Yeah, where is the fun in that?
Well its amusing to me as its obvious some take this way to seriously.
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My Tombstone will read: IwasburiedfacedownsoucanallkissmyA$$
my current grow
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OrgoneConclusion
Stranger
Registered: 05/06/11
Posts: 93
Last seen: 6 years, 10 months
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Re: Overdriven Shoplights!!! (Before you buy a T5 READ THIS) [Re: HempMaster]
#603191 - 12/28/11 03:18 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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I was dissed!
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Chapter 4
Registered: 08/27/08
Posts: 152
Last seen: 12 years, 10 months
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Re: Overdriven Shoplights!!! (Before you buy a T5 READ THIS) [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#603517 - 01/01/12 10:51 AM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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this thread is a riot.
one guy talking about how double the juice doesnt equal double the output, and he is right.
otehr talking about simply getting more output per surface area adn not caring about additional power use/efficiency.
and neither getting it at all.
classic 
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Hawksresurrection
Registered: 12/04/08
Posts: 13,464
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Re: Overdriven Shoplights!!! (Before you buy a T5 READ THIS) [Re: Chapter 4]
#603705 - 01/02/12 07:28 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
Chapter 4 said:
this thread is a riot.
one guy talking about how double the juice doesnt equal double the output, and he is right.
otehr talking about simply getting more output per surface area adn not caring about additional power use/efficiency.
and neither getting it at all.
classic
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Dude she isn't as young as she use to be.
-niteowl
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