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 I_AM_SWIM
Someone Who Isn't McKenna
Registered: 06/08/09
Posts: 1,337
Last seen: 12 years, 4 months
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 Re: I am now a vegetarian who is with ME???????  [Re: SalviaNshrooms9090]  1
#581624 - 08/28/11 12:25 PM (13 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
SalviaNshrooms9090 said:
u cant smoke weed and claim to be peaceful and them eat meat that makes you a hypocrit
I can say that I'm at peace with myself and the world when I'm baked out of my mind eating a nice medium cooked sirloin steak. 
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 Pandor
Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 503
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Re: I am now a vegetarian who is with ME??????? [Re: SalviaNshrooms9090]
#581629 - 08/28/11 01:26 PM (13 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
drawde said:
This whole Im better than you because I eat meat vs Im better than you because I am vegetarian thing is getting so fucking old. To each their own...
Although I will say I have not eaten an animal product in over three years, am in the best health of my life, have flawless skin, no body odor, dramatically increased physical stamina, and will probably live the rest of my life out comfortably without any degenerative diseases (all of which were the opposite before). But to each their own. 
This.....
to each their own yes.
everyone i know and love eats meat and i don't love them any less but...
I started to worry about my looks and my health when I got a little older and I started doing bikram yoga and eventually gave up meat and I am truly a new person. My concentration, focus, appearance, and quality of life have improved.
Meat is bad for you period. Sorry guys. You can argue forever, but it's been proven. Also it's been studied, researched, and proven that not only does the diet consisting of meat and dairy causes the western diseases, but also proven that once people come off the diet, 100% of them improve and I think it was like 75% of them actually heal their own bodies to the point where they don't have the disease anymore. This is all achieved on very moderate exercise such as a walk every day, no smoking or drinking, and a 100% vegan diet.
Quote:
SalviaNshrooms9090 said:
u cant smoke weed and claim to be peaceful and them eat meat that makes you a hypocrit
It doesn't make you a hypocrite to smoke weed and eat meat. I think he's saying that it's hard to achieve inner peace while eating something that lived a life of misery and suffering. And maybe he smokes weed because that helps in his search for inner peace. Just a thought...
Edited by Pandor (08/28/11 01:37 PM)
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THEBats
The Bridge Master
Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 8,488
Last seen: 11 years, 5 months
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Re: I am now a vegetarian who is with ME??????? [Re: Pandor] 1
#581633 - 08/28/11 01:39 PM (13 years, 3 months ago) |
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Well certainly animals can be killed humanly. For the most part they're not.
And of course red meat and high saturated fat are bad but the healthiest diets actually consist of a balance of lean fish and veggies, at least according to the largest peer reviewed study done on the subject. Diets consisting of lean meat and veggies show no clear disadvantage over a vegetarian diet. Vegan diets typically will come after, with diets consisting of red meat obviously being the most unhealthy. Really veganism is a first world luxury that humans would not be able to entertain without modern society and understanding of nutrition.
You can believe what you want, but to say eating meat is bad for you is an over generalization at best and an outright lie at it's worst.
http://www.ajcn.org/content/70/3/516S.full
Edited by THEBats (08/28/11 01:50 PM)
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drawde
Registered: 11/15/09
Posts: 5,268
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Re: I am now a vegetarian who is with ME??????? [Re: THEBats]
#581638 - 08/28/11 01:59 PM (13 years, 3 months ago) |
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You will never find the best diet for yourself by looking strictly at scientific research. I tried that and its never ending, there are just too many seemingly legitimate but conflicting studies. The only way to discern any sort of advantage is to form an opinion, and thats best done simply by trying different things and finding out first hand what your body responds to best.
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King Koopa said:
The amount of pot that Gask smokes is equivalent to a guy shooting heroin on weekends
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THEBats
The Bridge Master
Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 8,488
Last seen: 11 years, 5 months
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Re: I am now a vegetarian who is with ME??????? [Re: drawde] 2
#581639 - 08/28/11 02:04 PM (13 years, 3 months ago) |
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True and that actually ties into why I was arguing against pandors comment that meat is bad for you. It's not quite so black and white like that.
I primarily eat a diet of lean meat, fish and veggies. I rarely eat red meat, though I admit I love a good steak occasionally. I consider myself to be quite healthy. I also exercise though, which I think is key here. Really your overall health extends way beyond your diet, encompassing life style choices, exercise and genetic background.
Sometimes bad health is just dealt to you, regardless of how healthy you behave. Others seemingly put themselves in harms way daily but somehow live long lives.
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kickin-two-hundo said:
you know what i did in english class? I came to class stoned out of my mind every day, i chugged vodka in the back of class, i put dead fish in the ceiling tiles. i put a gallon of old milk and orange juice in the file cabinet before winter vacation. i brought snakes in a tied up sweater and let them loose during class. i didnt go to school to learn, i went because i had to. i didnt care, and i didn't fucking listen to that stupid bitch. and i still don't fucking care. i tore the pages out of her books and burned them, and threw away all the books in the class, two books per day. 
Edited by THEBats (08/28/11 02:12 PM)
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King Koopa
Natty
Registered: 06/25/08
Posts: 12,819
Last seen: 1 month, 7 days
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Re: I am now a vegetarian who is with ME??????? [Re: THEBats]
#581642 - 08/28/11 02:28 PM (13 years, 3 months ago) |
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--------------------
Alcoholics Anonymous is a fellowship of men and women who share their experience, strength and hope with each other that they may solve their common problem and help others to recover from alcoholism.
The only requirement for membership is a desire to stop drinking. There are no dues or fees for A.A. membership; we are self-supporting through our own contributions. A.A. is not allied with any sect, denomination, politics, organization or institution; does not wish to engage in any controversy; neither endorses nor opposes any causes. Our primary purpose is to stay sober and help other alcoholics to achieve sobriety.
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KaptKid
Spaced Pirate
Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 5,615
Loc: Bright Side of the Sun
Last seen: 1 year, 5 days
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 Re: I am now a vegetarian who is with ME??????? [Re: Pandor]
#581660 - 08/28/11 03:14 PM (13 years, 3 months ago) |
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If I don't drink.
Im gona kill people.
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Child of the 60's, Tripping ever sence.
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RasJeph
Psycho Pete
Registered: 01/14/09
Posts: 11,657
Loc: Bumfuckt Egypt
Last seen: 1 year, 27 days
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Re: I am now a vegetarian who is with ME??????? [Re: KaptKid]
#581662 - 08/28/11 03:18 PM (13 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
KaptKid said:
If I don't drink.
Im gona kill people.
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Of course it's happening inside your head.
Why should that mean it isn't real?
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King Koopa
Natty
Registered: 06/25/08
Posts: 12,819
Last seen: 1 month, 7 days
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Re: I am now a vegetarian who is with ME??????? [Re: RasJeph]
#581665 - 08/28/11 03:25 PM (13 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
RasJeph said:
Quote:
KaptKid said:
If we don't eat meat.
They gona start killing people.
--------------------
Alcoholics Anonymous is a fellowship of men and women who share their experience, strength and hope with each other that they may solve their common problem and help others to recover from alcoholism.
The only requirement for membership is a desire to stop drinking. There are no dues or fees for A.A. membership; we are self-supporting through our own contributions. A.A. is not allied with any sect, denomination, politics, organization or institution; does not wish to engage in any controversy; neither endorses nor opposes any causes. Our primary purpose is to stay sober and help other alcoholics to achieve sobriety.
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Hawksresurrection
Registered: 12/04/08
Posts: 13,464
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Re: I am now a vegetarian who is with ME??????? [Re: RasJeph]
#581669 - 08/28/11 03:58 PM (13 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
RasJeph said:
Quote:
KaptKid said:
If I don't drink.
Im gona kill people.
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Dude she isn't as young as she use to be.
-niteowl
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Pandor
Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 503
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Re: I am now a vegetarian who is with ME??????? [Re: Hawksresurrection]
#581670 - 08/28/11 04:37 PM (13 years, 3 months ago) |
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Blaming genetics for being fat or getting a diet related illness such as heart disease is out dated.
The vegan diet is well proven to be the most healthy diet.
The less meat you eat the better and if your at least not eating much meat and mostly lean whatever, good for you, you are better off than most.
I don't try to push what I know on others, but if it comes up, I try to inform people if they care to know.
Dr.Dean Ornish has written books on the studies he has done on the vegan diet and the literally thousands of peoples lives he has saved that had various diet related diseases. The dairy and meat people are constantly trying to discredit him and brainwash everyone in to thinking they still need meat and dairy.
That's my rant tried to break it up so it wasn't one big blahbhlablahgldkjsalkjskljdfkl
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THEBats
The Bridge Master
Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 8,488
Last seen: 11 years, 5 months
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Re: I am now a vegetarian who is with ME??????? [Re: Pandor]
#581672 - 08/28/11 04:43 PM (13 years, 3 months ago) |
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I'm not blaming genetics merely informing you that diet is only one piece of the small puzzle that contributes to someones overall health. If you're suggesting genetics plays no role, then I'm sorry you're wrong. And I'm sorry but veganism has not been proven to be the most healthy diet. See the link I posted above.
Of course there are studies that say otherwise but I have not seen a larger study than the one I've posted that was peer reviewed, and not plastered all over a vegan website that provides no links to outside scientific sources.
Of course none of this matters anyways. As I explained in my previous post, diet is one small part of living a healthy life. You're delusional if you think being vegan is the key to living a healthy life or that it makes a significant difference over someone who eats a balanced diet of lean meat and veggies along with exercise.
Also if you research the Dr. you posted you would find that even he doesn't follow a strict vegan diet, so there you go.
Oh and one other thing. His study, Lifestyle Heart Trial, only really focuses on the vegan diet with regards to heart health. And if you bother to check the link I posted you will also find that to be the only notable difference between diets in that study as well. Yet that study still reports people who consume a diet including fish and veggies to have a lower mortality rate than vegans.
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kickin-two-hundo said:
you know what i did in english class? I came to class stoned out of my mind every day, i chugged vodka in the back of class, i put dead fish in the ceiling tiles. i put a gallon of old milk and orange juice in the file cabinet before winter vacation. i brought snakes in a tied up sweater and let them loose during class. i didnt go to school to learn, i went because i had to. i didnt care, and i didn't fucking listen to that stupid bitch. and i still don't fucking care. i tore the pages out of her books and burned them, and threw away all the books in the class, two books per day.
Edited by THEBats (08/29/11 10:30 AM)
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Magash
The Feminizer
Registered: 04/21/08
Posts: 6,634
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Re: I am now a vegetarian who is with ME??????? [Re: Pandor]
#581678 - 08/28/11 04:58 PM (13 years, 3 months ago) |
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Ok, I gotta chime in here. Cause of my little battle with cancer here I've kind of studied this and what matters is Calorie count, grams of fat, grams of carbohydrates, grams of protein taken in each day. Eating the right amounts of meat is not bad for you only if abused. Even amounts of fish, poultry and red meat can be eaten. Meaning don't over do it on the high fat meats which are almost always red meat or pork.
Quote:
The vegan diet is well proven to be the most healthy diet.
This statement is absolutely untrue. I asked doctors at Stamford Hospital, The Cancer Institute, and the Hospital I'm currently getting my chemo from and none of them said it was a good idea to go vegan, not a single one.
Quote:
Dr.Dean Ornish
You may wanna ask just about any practicing doctor about him. I'm currently in a hospital so it's fairly easy for me to do. (yesterday and today are chemo days to the guys that sent me pm's and I'm slow with the laptop. )
I'm not slamming vegans or meat eaters but there are some things not true here on both sides. I know that for a fact.
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All creatures tremble when faced with violence. All creatures fear death, all love life. If we can only see ourselves in others, then how could we possibly hurt another creature?
 Join us at the Growery!
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THEBats
The Bridge Master
Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 8,488
Last seen: 11 years, 5 months
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Re: I am now a vegetarian who is with ME??????? [Re: Magash] 1
#581679 - 08/28/11 05:01 PM (13 years, 3 months ago) |
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Those doctors are obviously employed by the meat industry.
That sucks about the chemo magash. Hope you feel better soon and smoke until you're numb.
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kickin-two-hundo said:
you know what i did in english class? I came to class stoned out of my mind every day, i chugged vodka in the back of class, i put dead fish in the ceiling tiles. i put a gallon of old milk and orange juice in the file cabinet before winter vacation. i brought snakes in a tied up sweater and let them loose during class. i didnt go to school to learn, i went because i had to. i didnt care, and i didn't fucking listen to that stupid bitch. and i still don't fucking care. i tore the pages out of her books and burned them, and threw away all the books in the class, two books per day.
Edited by THEBats (08/28/11 05:02 PM)
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Pandor
Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 503
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Re: I am now a vegetarian who is with ME??????? [Re: THEBats]
#581680 - 08/28/11 05:03 PM (13 years, 3 months ago) |
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I never said diet was the only piece of the puzzle. Diet plays a much larger role than people think. I mentioned earlier that I do exercise, every day by the way.
If more people would just try it and actually experience how much better they feel, more people would start believing that it is just so much better for your over all health and well being. Plus I eat as much as I want when ever I am hungry and never gain a pound. Everything tastes better and I really enjoy eating now more than ever.
I'm just trying to share my joy. I've lived a miserable life before at times and now I am the happiest I have ever been and this has a lot to do with it.
And I still drink occasionally. Usually in moderation. And I smoke weed every day. And I even party a little harder occasionally. Not ready to give all that up, probably never will. But I am telling you guys, changing my diet was huge and I feel great about it.
Sorry Magesh, but many, actually most doctors don't know shit about diet. They study exactly 3 hours on diet throughout regular medical school.
Edited by Pandor (08/28/11 05:13 PM)
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drawde
Registered: 11/15/09
Posts: 5,268
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Re: I am now a vegetarian who is with ME??????? [Re: Magash]
#581681 - 08/28/11 05:04 PM (13 years, 3 months ago) |
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Doctors who practice chemo therapy treatments are notoriously one-track minded. I would not take much they say to heart other than the chemo facts themselves. Even if they said go vegan I would still tell you this.
Doctors in general also have notoriously little training in diet but that is getting slightly better in recent years.
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King Koopa said:
The amount of pot that Gask smokes is equivalent to a guy shooting heroin on weekends
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THEBats
The Bridge Master
Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 8,488
Last seen: 11 years, 5 months
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Re: I am now a vegetarian who is with ME??????? [Re: Pandor]
#581685 - 08/28/11 05:12 PM (13 years, 3 months ago) |
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Well there's a lot to say psychologically about why one might feel better after switching to a diet they perceive as more healthy as well as one in which requires more control. There's also I'm sure a whole bunch of good feelings that come from the thought of you being more "informed" ect.
Also pandor is there a reason you ignored the rest of my post?
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kickin-two-hundo said:
you know what i did in english class? I came to class stoned out of my mind every day, i chugged vodka in the back of class, i put dead fish in the ceiling tiles. i put a gallon of old milk and orange juice in the file cabinet before winter vacation. i brought snakes in a tied up sweater and let them loose during class. i didnt go to school to learn, i went because i had to. i didnt care, and i didn't fucking listen to that stupid bitch. and i still don't fucking care. i tore the pages out of her books and burned them, and threw away all the books in the class, two books per day.
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Pandor
Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 503
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Re: I am now a vegetarian who is with ME??????? [Re: THEBats]
#581686 - 08/28/11 05:14 PM (13 years, 3 months ago) |
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what part would you like me to respond to?
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THEBats
The Bridge Master
Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 8,488
Last seen: 11 years, 5 months
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Re: I am now a vegetarian who is with ME??????? [Re: Pandor]
#581688 - 08/28/11 05:21 PM (13 years, 3 months ago) |
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About how the doctor you posted doesn't follow a strict vegan diet. About how the study he was involved in only discussed heart health. How the study, or rather collection of 5 studies I posted also noted this difference but noted that a diet of fish and veggies to have a lower mortality rate than vegans.
In any case, if you feel good being vegan that's great. But don't try to use bad science to convince other people that your diet is somehow superior and throw out unintentional hyperboles such as it's been proven to be more healthy.
Really there's no way to definitively prove that unless we were to gather up a bunch of humans, raise them in a lab and monitor their diets until death, while keeping all other factors the same. It can't be done, which is why it's short sighted to definitively conclude anything in regards to diet and overall health.
We can reasonably conclude which things in excess are bad but apart from that it's really difficult to get a clear answer, and certainly one that's free from bias.
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kickin-two-hundo said:
you know what i did in english class? I came to class stoned out of my mind every day, i chugged vodka in the back of class, i put dead fish in the ceiling tiles. i put a gallon of old milk and orange juice in the file cabinet before winter vacation. i brought snakes in a tied up sweater and let them loose during class. i didnt go to school to learn, i went because i had to. i didnt care, and i didn't fucking listen to that stupid bitch. and i still don't fucking care. i tore the pages out of her books and burned them, and threw away all the books in the class, two books per day.
Edited by THEBats (08/28/11 05:23 PM)
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Magash
The Feminizer
Registered: 04/21/08
Posts: 6,634
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Re: I am now a vegetarian who is with ME??????? [Re: drawde]
#581690 - 08/28/11 05:23 PM (13 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
They study exactly 3 hours on diet throughout regular medical school.
There are currently doctors laughing their asses off to this. One of my doctors is a nutritionist and you can't get him to agree either.
Quote:
Doctors who practice chemo therapy treatments are notoriously one-track minded. I would not take much they say to heart other than the chemo facts themselves. Even if they said go vegan I would still tell you this.
So you have cancer and around them all the time? They could care less if your vegan or not. To say they are one track minded is fairly stupid and it's made up.
So now what you gonna tell me the nutritionist only had 6 hrs of training.
As far as working out I do 3 days a week with weights and 3 cardio. Sundays off. I lost 70lbs from july 2010 to Feb 2011.
Mondays Chest, Back and Tri's, Tues cardio, Wed Back and Bi's, Thurs cardio, Fridays Back and Legs, Sat Cardio again.
Calorie intake is 1800, Fat is kept at 53 grams, Carbo's are 180 max, Protein is 190 grams.
An average McDonalds meal does that in one sitting.
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All creatures tremble when faced with violence. All creatures fear death, all love life. If we can only see ourselves in others, then how could we possibly hurt another creature?
Join us at the Growery!
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