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Invisiblemaryanne3087
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Re: First timer. Critique my germination process and my veg room. [Re: Magash]
    #511182 - 01/05/11 05:39 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Me too.

It's silly to not because you will need to harden them off when they're exposed to HID if you have them under some sissy fluorescent lighting.

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Invisiblemaryanne3087
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Re: First timer. Critique my germination process and my veg room. [Re: Pandor]
    #511341 - 01/05/11 11:29 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

I use 24 hours of light BUT only because my current veg room is kinda shitty and has light leaks(until I fix those this weekend), so that's a perk of 24 hours  of light, you can't have any light leaks affect your plants negatively since they're under constant light.

I do believe plants will benefit in terms of vigor from an 18/6 light schedule but I also find that plants stretch more and flowering isn't established as quickly when your veg to flower light hours aren't far apart sometimes I even start flowering @ 10 hours a day light. I don't know if this gives an added benefit as I'm not very scientific about my methods but I do think it speeds up the flowering of some of my long flower hazes esp when grown from seed.

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Invisiblemaryanne3087
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Re: First timer. Critique my germination process and my veg room. [Re: Pandor]
    #511342 - 01/05/11 11:33 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Pandor said:
When you say you start them out under full lights, you mean after a few days for germination, right?

And opinions on using 18 or 24 hrs of light?

Thank you




My coco plugs go under the lights, the seeds don't sprout all at once so I suppose I could leave the light off until the first sprout emerges but after that they need light. I plant 72 + seeds at a time so I don't really have the patience to wait for a sprout to emerge, nor do I have patience for pregermination methods.

BTW I hang my lights high like 4ft above the seedlings but it's all relative to how cool your room is or more importantly how cool the temperature is at the seedling's canopy or the temp right at the seedlings foliage however you want to think of it.

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Invisiblemaryanne3087
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Re: First timer. Critique my germination process and my veg room. [Re: Pandor]
    #511397 - 01/06/11 08:24 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Application of nutrients depends on your medium. You can feed sprouts tap water for a week maybe two I give them a very light dose of nutrients right when they develop their first true set of leaves (beyond their cotyledons).

If you're in soil you can go longer without "feeding" them since the soil has nutrients built into it.

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Invisiblemaryanne3087
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Re: First timer. Critique my germination process and my veg room. [Re: Pandor]
    #511852 - 01/08/11 07:21 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Use a dome for clones, not seedlings.

If you were to use a dome I'd only use it until the first seed pops to retain moisture in your medium, this would be a good idea if you were germing some old seeds and didn't have time to give them attention. Otherwise it's pretty pointless.

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Invisiblemaryanne3087
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Re: First timer. Critique my germination process and my veg room. [Re: Pandor]
    #511916 - 01/08/11 01:44 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Pandor said:
Thanks so much Magash, maryanne3087, and everyone.

I'm on a second read of "The Bible" by Cervantes, I've read 2 other books, and I watch videos all the time, but you guys really help the most. Simple questions like the one about the dome are not addressed there. I really appreciate your input.

White Rhino and one Church went in today.

Thanks again. Going to start a grow log as soon as I have more pictures.




Reading Marijuana Horticulture Grower Bible by Jorge Cervantes without having prior experience could put you back more than it puts you forward. There's a lot of inaccurate information in the  book, most of the inaccuracies aren't things that would ruin a grow but I don't think it's good to learn things that aren't factual.

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Invisiblemaryanne3087
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Re: First timer. Critique my germination process and my veg room. [Re: Pandor]
    #511964 - 01/08/11 03:04 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

A fan is more to move air/co2 around the leaves so the leaves have a fresh supply of co2. There is benefit from strengthening stems but indoors it's minimal since we pack our plants together fairly tight and they won't be moving around once they put on a certain amount of weight.

So to answer your question better, so long as the leaves are moving from the fan that's enough in room circulation. You also want to have fresh air coming into your room I change the volume of air in my room every minute along with having 5 circulation fans in my 12x12' room which I rearrange as I see fit.

The distance you put your plants from the light is to preventing burning from heat. CFLs are not very hot at all, they create more heat than HPS bulbs per watt but CFLS are generally low wattage and their shape seems to let them shed heat well. I don't personally use CFLs at all but I do use florescent lights (tube) now and then for seedlings and I keep them less than 3 inches away. If you see burning of the foliage you know you're too close, unless you turn your plant into a crispy turd it will just set you back a bit while your plant recovers but won't ruin your grow. That is so long as your plant is able to recover from the damage.

Don't be scared to experiment. It's less dangerous than reading Jorge Cervantes.

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Invisiblemaryanne3087
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Re: First timer. Critique my germination process and my veg room. [Re: Pandor]
    #512006 - 01/08/11 05:03 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Compact florescent = spiral tube thingy.



Regular = straight tube.


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Invisiblemaryanne3087
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Re: First timer. Critique my germination process and my veg room. [Re: Magash]
    #512192 - 01/09/11 07:21 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Well potting mix isn't to say soil mix so that one is passable.

I don't exactly have each thing I've read that isn't accurate in the book highlighted but if you read through it you won't have to read very far to find something that isn't accurate. Stuff like referring to trichoderma as bacteria when it's a fungi. Pandor said it says to hang CFL's 12-18" above the canopy when they're probably best hung 6" from the canopy due to lumen drop at greater distances and not much worry of heat as another example.

Chimera said Greg Green was a noobie poster over at OG and would get involved in every discussion spewing nonsense all over the place and then when OG went under he published books under his Greg Green alias via massive copy and paste.

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Invisiblemaryanne3087
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Re: First timer. Critique my germination process and my veg room. [Re: Pandor]
    #512264 - 01/09/11 01:35 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

You probably could if it's not too hot but that seems like a good distance. I almost always have my seedlings within 6 inches of the light when using florescent and whatever distance I feel won't burn them when using HID.

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Invisiblemaryanne3087
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Re: First timer. Critique my germination process and my veg room. [Re: muse42]
    #512280 - 01/09/11 02:03 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

I'd guess 10-12"

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Invisiblemaryanne3087
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Re: First timer. Critique my germination process and my veg room. [Re: Pandor]
    #512628 - 01/10/11 05:05 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

The root shooting out the bottom is a tap root, they don't need to be replanted yet.

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Invisiblemaryanne3087
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Re: First timer. Critique my germination process and my veg room. [Re: Pandor]
    #512781 - 01/10/11 08:12 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Pandor said:
But the roots that are shooting out of the bottom look a little wilted.
Is this a cause for concern?

Approximately how long until I need to transplant?




You can transplant whenever you want but I wait for my coco plugs to fill out with roots so that the bottoms have multiple roots showing and not just the tap root then I cut away the plastic as gently as possible and transplant into a larger container.

IMO, letting the roots fill up the container leads to the strongest root ball possible, as does as many transplants as possible however the more transplants you do the less efficient your crop gets in terms of labor and time and cost to an extent. So that's something to consider.

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Invisiblemaryanne3087
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Re: First timer. Critique my germination process and my veg room. [Re: Pandor]
    #513154 - 01/11/11 11:16 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Pandor said:
Quote:

maryanne3087 said:
Quote:

Pandor said:
But the roots that are shooting out of the bottom look a little wilted.
Is this a cause for concern?

Approximately how long until I need to transplant?




You can transplant whenever you want but I wait for my coco plugs to fill out with roots so that the bottoms have multiple roots showing and not just the tap root then I cut away the plastic as gently as possible and transplant into a larger container.

IMO, letting the roots fill up the container leads to the strongest root ball possible, as does as many transplants as possible however the more transplants you do the less efficient your crop gets in terms of labor and time and cost to an extent. So that's something to consider.




The only thing that worries me is that you say "multiple roots showing". The roots that have grown out of the bottoms have shriveled up and died.

This morning I found one plant is leaning over and it's leaves are actually touching the dirt.

The more I read and hear about these plugs, the more I don't like my using them.

I am seriously considering going out to buy little plastic cups and transplanting these. Either in to a soil less mix, or orgainic (FF, yes I researched) soil.

If I go with the soil, should I continue to skip the nutes?
With the soiless mix, is the following picture a good nute?
This is what the guy at the store recommended.

Oh and one more question.

If you use little cups, do you make holes in the bottom?

Thanks everyone for you input on my thread. I really love this site just as much as I loved using Shroomery.






I put like 2-4 holes into solo cups (16oz beer cups) and sometimes use those usually for clones. I also have slightly smaller square pots I use.

The plugs I use are filled by myself, it's just a tray with a bunch of cells I fill with coco.

I'd transplant if your plants are flopping over. That's really odd assuming I'm understanding you right, that your tap root broke through the bottom then died. What I meant by fill out the start cube with roots is basically what's shown on the CLonex bottle you posted, but I probably wouldn't wait that long.

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Invisiblemaryanne3087
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Re: First timer. Critique my germination process and my veg room. [Re: Pandor]
    #513195 - 01/12/11 08:37 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

I don't personally use clonex but you should have ennough nutrients in your tap water/stored within the cotyledon/embryo until your plants at least develop a couple of sets of leaves at which point you can give them some nutrients. I use 140ppm tap water until the 2nd set of true leaves, then I give them 300ppm dilute nutrients and increase accordingly.

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Re: First timer. Critique my germination process and my veg room. [Re: mad capper]
    #513335 - 01/12/11 10:57 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Coco is more soilless than peat is. Peat is more decayed and humus rich where coco is more of a fibrous inert medium. You can witness this a number of ways one way is growing in peat and noticing that the medium breaks down to approx 2/3 the size due to microbial activity (being more soil-like) something I never liked and tried to battle using denser more humus rich additions of worm castings and using additions that wouldn't break down as quickly which lead me to adding perlite and coco and ultimately switching to coco entirely.

Fungi and bacteria which are known as biological chelators do just that chelate and fix nutrients. This is beneficial in terms of yield and avoiding deficiencies but it should also be considered that they increase the uptake of heavy metals which are very present in peat but not so much in coco.

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Invisiblemaryanne3087
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Re: First timer. Critique my germination process and my veg room. [Re: Pandor]
    #513344 - 01/13/11 12:35 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Man, coco isn't anything scary. Proper soil growing imo is more intimidating to a beginner. Proper as in building a real soil and not buying FFOF and their line of nutrients which complement their incomplete soil.

Rinse your coco blocks well to make sure you don't have any nasty salt build up. If the texture is shitty add perlite. Keep your pH in check (5.7-6.1) the higher end is better to avoid acidification of your medium (as in it's safer to use 6-6.1 than ~5.7 some use 5.5 and don't have problems). Keep your PPM/feeding strength "low" I use a PPM of 700-840 if you think more is better definitely don't exceed 1100 for constant feeding or you will more than likely lock out nutrients, it's been proven time and time again that slamming your plants with high concentration of nutrients doesn't = more yield. Getting some run off each watering will also benefit the plants greatly as it's a mini flush each watering to avoid salt build up.

FWIW, if you want a worry free soil, build a amended soil and plant into huge fucking pots or better yet a soil bed and you won't have shit to worry about. Small containers and soil is where all the bottled nutrients come into play. This however isn't practical for most people because of transporting large amounts of soil. I think the biggest set back in a grow is pests too which coco excels at over soil 10 fold coco is heaps cleaner.

Time to sleep long day tomorrow, post up any questions and I'll do my best to sort you out.

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Invisiblemaryanne3087
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Re: First timer. Critique my germination process and my veg room. [Re: Pandor]
    #513348 - 01/13/11 01:48 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

You're in luck. Insomnia strikes again, I'll be online until the medication kicks in.

If you're using RO the people you're purchasing it from should be able to tell you what PPM the water is if it's close to 0 ppm it should have a neutral pH since distilled water or pure H2O = 0 ppm and a pH of 7.

For pH you really only need to pH after you've added nutrients before adding nutrients isn't really relavent, if you're always using RO water you could probably get away with formula mixing just using the same mix each time. Checking for my reservoir is easy because I invested in a Bluelab Guardian which tells me the temp, pH, and EC/ppm/tds of the water which is handy because it can drift.

PPM is a conversion of Electric conductivity to assess the hardiness of water or the concentration of nutrients in our case. If you've got the money I'd suggest buying one of these also.

I don't know about the Clonex product, it sounds like it's for seedlings. I personally use General Hydroponics Flora series or Floranova. The Floranova is a one part nutrient and is fairly easy to use you I don't know if I will continue with the Floranova after I run out and currently I'm just trying to use it up so I switch between doses of Floranova and Flora Micro + Bloom which is a consistent mix and seems to be more pH stable. Mixing 2 bottles isn't very complicated either considering some growers mix 10 sometimes 20 different products to achieve similar or worse results. I'd suggest buying a bottle of Flora Micro and Bloom and using 6 ml micro, 9 ml bloom for full strength and clonex should do you good until you can feed this formula. I can tell you that using RO water and 6/9 formula you will be bang around the money for pH, you may even be able to get away with just buying a $10 dropper pH kit and testing it once to make sure your pH is in the right range.

Rinsing with tap water shouldn't be a worry unless you have like 1000 PPM tap water, even then it's probably loaded with calcium and Magnesium and the excess will just get flushed away when you water with your nutrients. If you buy a good brand of coco you can get away without rinsing but I never really trust it, if your coco is a bad batch which can happen with any company and the salt content is too high your roots will basically stop growing once transplanted into it and you likely won't noticed for a week or so since that's the expected time for transplant shock and then you're either set back big time or you lose your plants. Happened to a friend of mine on a rather large grow with Canna coco. Your criteria for selecting coco is texture and low salt content basically if you got that sorted you're good.

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Invisiblemaryanne3087
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Re: First timer. Critique my germination process and my veg room. [Re: Pandor]
    #513538 - 01/14/11 02:01 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

whoa whoa whoa...

I hope you didn't buy Floranova Grow, Floranova Bloom, and Flora Micro...

Floranova grow = single part for Veg
Floranova Bloom = single part for bloom
Flora Micro = 1 of 3 parts as the base component that contains micros/nitrogen/etc not very useful on it's own.

It would basically be either Floranova or Flora Micro + Flora Bloom... Using both isn't useful.

Since the single parts are self explanatory...

When using the Flora series you have the Grow component, Micro component, and the Bloom component. The Micro is the back bone for lack of a better analogy you could call it the meeting grown for Veg and Bloom, it contains what is essential throughout your grow and the Bloom and Grow components are to tailor the mix to the veg and bloom needs of a plant. There's a lot of consensus that plants needs don't change much between veg and flowering and that a sensible nutrient profile will nourish your plants throughout their life. The 6ml per gal Flora Micro and 9ML per gal Flora Bloom will give you a sensible nutrient profile that will nourish most if not all plants esp when grown in coco. A couple of breeders over at ICMAG.com actually use this formula to grow all of their strains with seemingly no problems at all, I modify my nutrient regiment to include more potassium, calcium, magnesium and silica and less phosphorus.

Opps, wrong this out and didn't hit post for a while :P

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Invisiblemaryanne3087
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Re: First timer. Critique my germination process and my veg room. [Re: grbrlt]
    #513560 - 01/14/11 07:07 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

pH of 7 + additional nutes will likely make his nutrients too acidic for the record or at least more acidic than my own recommendation.

My pH is like 8, I use the 6/9 formula and end up ugh I can't remember but it's not very far off target then I play with things.

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