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 DungenessDank
Lord of the Flies
Registered: 05/05/08
Posts: 9,372
Loc: PNW
Last seen: 11 years, 6 months
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 Re: BAM HEALTHCARE  [Re: DieselB]
#388658 - 03/23/10 09:40 AM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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Its just another sign of the death of the American dream.
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 Harry_Ba11sach
cannoisseur
Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 11,753
Loc: Nepal 
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the American Dream is to die of a curable disease because you can't afford health care?
Well shit, I better move then
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DungenessDank
Lord of the Flies
Registered: 05/05/08
Posts: 9,372
Loc: PNW
Last seen: 11 years, 6 months
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I know I have a different perspective than most folks, but if I get going on it I'll never shut up. I just hope they know there's at least 2 times the number of illegal immigrants in this country than they estimate. They are going to be a very heavy burden on this system. My state has had socialized health care for years, and its gotten so bad economically that they had to stop taking new people into the system.
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Tangerines
Grease Wizard
Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 9,497
Last seen: 6 years, 5 months
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So my Grandfather is going to have to pay more money for medicaid and now some doctors won't be accepting medicaid because they will be getting paid less. How is that fair? He pays more for less. That is fucked up in my eyes.
I do not understand why they lumped all the parts of the bill together instead of working with the issues seperately. More bullshit. Sure there are parts of the bill that are nice but there are some majorly bad parts.
I have no problem paying for someone to go to the ER, but I do have a problem paying for someone to go get regular check ups etc. So when I get a job I will have to pay for my own health care and the health care of degenerates.
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TomCollins
Registered: 10/06/09
Posts: 2,943
Last seen: 11 months, 11 days
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Tangerines]
#388690 - 03/23/10 11:31 AM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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Quote:
DieselB said:
Europe is doing so great, huh? Why? because they have better pot laws? Their healthcare sucks, you tell me whats better when it comes to ANYTHING, the free version or the pay version.. Remember, "You get what you pay for"?
Do you have evidence to support this statement?
I have lived in 5 different countries here in Europe and am currently on government health care and I seriously question what you just said. Do you even own a passport?
Your logic is completely flawed in my eyes anyway. You ask what's better, the pay version or the free version. I ask you this. What's better: something or nothing at all.
Your ignoring the point behind this bill because people like you have to dish out more cash. Cry me a river. This bill is meant to provide healthcare for those who can't afford it. Plain and simple.
If you want better, go spend more money.
Quote:
Tangerines said:
So my Grandfather is going to have to pay more money for medicaid and now some doctors won't be accepting medicaid because they will be getting paid less. How is that fair? He pays more for less. That is fucked up in my eyes.
Sure. There are people on various already existing healthcare. Sure there are people that are in great health and shouldn't be forced to pay for health care if they don't want to. Of course it sucks for those people, but unfortunately this bill is for the greater majority and future generations of your country men. This bill will make 15 million Americans eligible for health care. That's not a good thing?
I'm sorry to say this but your grandfather is not a special unique person. There are other people with needs far greater than him and that have no money. This bill is for those people. Remind yourself that your grandfather will survive this "horrible tragedy" as will many other people including yourself. This I'm sure of.
It will no doubt be a difficult transition, but quite honestly, universal mandatory healthcare is a human right that your government is denying your citizens. Plain and simple. If you guys plan to keep "promoting and preserving freedom" around the world, perhaps it's best you shape up on the home front a little.
I think you have a very biased opinion, because someone you are closely related to is getting the short end of the stick with this bill. The fact is there are almost 400 million Americans that share the same country as you.
Also, any doctor that denies government health care because it's not enough for his pockets is no better than a drug dealer quite honestly. Evidently the doctors your grandfather is seeing are those greedy over prescribers I read about everyday. I hope this bill leads your grandfather to more honest doctors who are interested in helping people and not money.
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andyistic said:
Ok so let me bring you idiots up to speed.
The admins are tired of this shitfest being made the joke of the weed community on the Internet.
Edited by TomCollins (03/23/10 11:36 AM)
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Tangerines
Grease Wizard
Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 9,497
Last seen: 6 years, 5 months
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: TomCollins]
#388693 - 03/23/10 11:38 AM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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So now if my grandfather cannot afford the increase he is just SOL? Fuck you man. It's not like he is rich or anything. Just a poor old man who now won't be able to afford his own health care because he has to pay for others.
The government is going to make it ILLEGAL to not have health insurance. That is fucking unconstitutional. They cannot make anyone get health care. Fuck that.
Why should people have to pay for other peoples health? Health should be a family issue the government should not be getting involved. Why should people have to pay for crackhead suzie and her 5 illegitimate babies?
This is just going to increase taxes to pay for this shit. Our country was pretty much FOUNDED because we disliked heavy taxes. 
It's like BO thinks we can just pull money out of our asses.
If I work hard for my money why should I have to give it away to help people that don't work for their money?
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TomCollins
Registered: 10/06/09
Posts: 2,943
Last seen: 11 months, 11 days
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Tangerines]
#388698 - 03/23/10 11:54 AM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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Quote:
Tangerines said:
So now if my grandfather cannot afford the increase he is just SOL? Fuck you man. It's not like he is rich or anything. Just a poor old man who now won't be able to afford his own health care because he has to pay for others.
Unfortunately this is what most of us actually call fair. He's always going to have health care now.
Quote:
Tangerines said:The government is going to make it ILLEGAL to not have health insurance. That is fucking unconstitutional. They cannot make anyone get health care. Fuck that.
Why should people have to pay for other peoples health? Health should be a family issue the government should not be getting involved. Why should people have to pay for crackhead suzie and her 5 illegitimate babies?
Yes they can, and that's how it should be. No matter who you are, you should have the right to seek medical help. This bill ensures everyone has help if they need it, and that everyone is contributing their fair share to make that a reality.
Quote:
Tangerines said:This is just going to increase taxes to pay for this shit. Our country was pretty much FOUNDED because we disliked heavy taxes.
Actually, I don't mean to be an asshole here, but I believe it was because your country was being taxed WITHOUT REPRESENTATION by a tyrannical foreign entity. 
It will increase taxes, but it's for a good cause. Don't you care about anyone else other than you and your immediate circle of family and friends?
Quote:
Tangerines said:It's like BO thinks we can just pull money out of our asses.
If I work hard for my money why should I have to give it away to help people that don't work for their money?
Because some people can't work at all because they're injured or sick and can't pay for the medical bills. Some people are severely mentally or physically handicapped and cannot work at all - that's the problem.
Try and understand. I sympathize for your grandfather and I know it must be hard financially, but quite honestly I can't really shed a tear for your grandfather when there are people who are completely helpless and in need. It's just not fair.
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andyistic said:
Ok so let me bring you idiots up to speed.
The admins are tired of this shitfest being made the joke of the weed community on the Internet.
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niteowl
GrandPaw
Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 4,781
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Tangerines]
#388699 - 03/23/10 11:56 AM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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Quote:
Tangerines said:
Why should people have to pay for other peoples health? Health should be a family issue the government should not be getting involved. Why should people have to pay for crackhead suzie and her 5 illegitimate babies?
Why should people have to pay for other peoples property protection? Protection should be a family issue the government should not be getting involved. Why should people have to pay for crackhead suzie and her 5 illegitimate babies when their house burns down because she was smoking crack?
your arguments are retarded and based on ignorance
health care is a social issue and needs to be handled by the society
same with property protection and public education
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The Ego is a pathological conditionlike a calcareous tumor or cystthat begins growing in the personalityin the absence of hallucinogenic substances-Terence McKenna-
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Tangerines
Grease Wizard
Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 9,497
Last seen: 6 years, 5 months
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: TomCollins]
#388703 - 03/23/10 12:06 PM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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Yes I only care about my direct circle of people. My clan if you will. That is how it should be I do not need the government to be breathing down my neck. I will take care of my own. If people cannot take care of their own then they should fade away. Survival of the fittest should apply to humans as well.
And it is unconstitutional to force people to have health insurance. If I do not want health insurance I should not be forced to have it. That is fucked up man.
I do not believe health care should be a social issue. Why do I care if someone I don't know can afford health care? I'm not going to lie, I don't care about people I don't know. I don't have time to worry about every American. I would rather spend my time and money on my family. Family comes first. If someone in my family had a terrible disease my family would band together to get them help Close knit families FTW.
Yea, I'm an asshole.
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ltd
Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 6,042
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: niteowl]
#388704 - 03/23/10 12:07 PM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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i agree with tang
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Doitagain
Smoothie therapist
Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 7,226
Loc: i am everywhere and nowhe...
Last seen: 14 years, 5 months
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: DieselB]
#388707 - 03/23/10 12:10 PM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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Quote:
DieselB said:
Sorry, but a lot of you guys need to wake up and smell the java.. I don't even know where to begin.. How about Obama PROMISING bipartisan support, and the only bipartisanship is dems and repubs voting against it! Obama PROMISED complete trasparency. He delivered nan.. Instead you got Pelosi up there telling us that (paraphrasing) "We can't find out whats in the bill till we vote it in, its so special, its a surprise!"
I don't like surprises from my government, how about you, do you really feel comfortable with the rate government is growing? They have done nothing but fuck up continually on both sides, now they control 1/6th of the economy!? We're already goin' down the toilet.
Europe is doing so great, huh? Why? because they have better pot laws? Their healthcare sucks, you tell me whats better when it comes to ANYTHING, the free version or the pay version.. Remember, "You get what you pay for"?
Dems are gonna regret this come november, mark my words.
And no, I'm not some sour repub. I am a proud American that can't believe his eyes, one that's starting to be not so proud, one that's fearing for his countries destruction. Everyday we go deeper into debt, not long ago Sec. Clinton was in China begging them to keep buying our debt, they're gonna realize we're not gonna be able to pay it back, they're gonna drop our debt... You think the past little while has been a recession, some say DEPRESSION. You've seen nothing yet.
bro it's absolutely clear that you have no idea what the fuck you are talking about, and are just spouting your mouth off and you're clearly influenced by the great american delusion that we must be the best at everything.
It's clear you've probably never left your country, so i will let you in on a secret. The system works, period. The united states does not have better health-care than Israel, Australia, Germany pretty much any 1st world western nation has the system in place and it works better than ours.
In Israel the quality of health-care i received was every bit as good as it was when I was insured here. Health-care doesn't need to cost nearly as much as it does to be good, the main reason it is so costly is because of the massive amounts of profits made by pharmaceutical and biomedical companies, this is an issue that needs addressed.
you may very well find yourself losing your job someday or in a situation that would have left you w/o healthcare. When you get sick and get treatment for it you will thank the dems for getting this through.
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ltd said:
fgts just don't understand
keep the shit
Edited by Doitagain (03/23/10 12:11 PM)
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Doitagain
Smoothie therapist
Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 7,226
Loc: i am everywhere and nowhe...
Last seen: 14 years, 5 months
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Tangerines]
#388708 - 03/23/10 12:13 PM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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Quote:
Tangerines said:
Yes I only care about my direct circle of people. My clan if you will. That is how it should be I do not need the government to be breathing down my neck. I will take care of my own. If people cannot take care of their own then they should fade away. Survival of the fittest should apply to humans as well.
And it is unconstitutional to force people to have health insurance. If I do not want health insurance I should not be forced to have it. That is fucked up man.
I do not believe health care should be a social issue. Why do I care if someone I don't know can afford health care? I'm not going to lie, I don't care about people I don't know. I don't have time to worry about every American. I would rather spend my time and money on my family. Family comes first. If someone in my family had a terrible disease my family would band together to get them help Close knit families FTW.
Yea, I'm an asshole.
i seriously doubt any fine are going to be levied on ppl for not having it, honestly who gives a shit, everybody should have health insurance, we are just now catching up with other 1st world western nations.
Have the things our government does are unconstitutional but they still do them, some of them are actually necessary.
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ltd said:
fgts just don't understand
keep the shit
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Doitagain
Smoothie therapist
Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 7,226
Loc: i am everywhere and nowhe...
Last seen: 14 years, 5 months
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Doitagain]
#388709 - 03/23/10 12:14 PM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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Quote:
Doitagain said:
Quote:
Triptonic said:
I never said I didnt support it, it just seems like a waste of money right now. How about him trying to find jobs for the millions of people out of work right now. Then worry about healthcare. I think he just hasnt thought it out quite enough.
lol yeah he should just write a law that creates jobs for all the unemployed people, and then he can write another law that ends the war in Iraq.
cause presidents totally have the power to do all that shit. 
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ltd said:
fgts just don't understand
keep the shit
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TomCollins
Registered: 10/06/09
Posts: 2,943
Last seen: 11 months, 11 days
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Tangerines]
#388712 - 03/23/10 12:21 PM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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Quote:
Tangerines said:
Yes I only care about my direct circle of people. My clan if you will. That is how it should be I do not need the government to be breathing down my neck. I will take care of my own. If people cannot take care of their own then they should fade away. Survival of the fittest should apply to humans as well.
And it is unconstitutional to force people to have health insurance. If I do not want health insurance I should not be forced to have it. That is fucked up man.
I do not believe health care should be a social issue. Why do I care if someone I don't know can afford health care? I'm not going to lie, I don't care about people I don't know. I don't have time to worry about every American. I would rather spend my time and money on my family. Family comes first. If someone in my family had a terrible disease my family would band together to get them help Close knit families FTW.
So what do orphans do? What do people without families do? Displaced refugees? Oh right... you don't care about people. I guess if your born lucky that just gives you the right to give everyone else the finger. Take all you can for yourself and burn all in your path. America... fuck yeah. Alright. Suit yourself.
To reiterate the point the niteowl made. This is just like saying "it's unconstitutional for the government to force your kids to go to school." This is just like saying, "if someone can't afford education for their children, then too bad." This is just like saying, "why should I have to pay for someone elses kids to go to school." 
Once again, here is the answer: Just like healthcare, access to education is a human right.
I guess there is just nothing more to be said.
Quote:
Tangerines said:Yea, I'm an asshole.
QFT
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andyistic said:
Ok so let me bring you idiots up to speed.
The admins are tired of this shitfest being made the joke of the weed community on the Internet.
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Tangerines
Grease Wizard
Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 9,497
Last seen: 6 years, 5 months
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: TomCollins]
#388717 - 03/23/10 12:34 PM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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Since when is health care and education a human right? It's a privilege. We shouldn't forget that. Thinking otherwise is taking things for granted. What's next? Is driving a car a right? "No child left behind" we should give them all cars.
We can't save everyone and we should not want to save everyone. And just to clarify I did not grow up in a rich household. Just an average American household.
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Doitagain
Smoothie therapist
Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 7,226
Loc: i am everywhere and nowhe...
Last seen: 14 years, 5 months
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Tangerines]
#388720 - 03/23/10 12:37 PM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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Quote:
Tangerines said:
Since when is health care and education a human right? It's a privilege. We shouldn't forget that. Thinking otherwise is taking things for granted. What's next? Is driving a car a right? "No child left behind" we should give them all cars.
We can't save everyone and we should not want to save everyone. And just to clarify I did not grow up in a rich household. Just an average American household.
Every other western country has advanced to the point where it is a right...
What do you have against progress?
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ltd said:
fgts just don't understand
keep the shit
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Tangerines
Grease Wizard
Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 9,497
Last seen: 6 years, 5 months
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Doitagain]
#388722 - 03/23/10 12:40 PM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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Just because every other western nation has done it does not mean it is progress...
America is not "every other western country"... why do we have to play follow the leader?
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TomCollins
Registered: 10/06/09
Posts: 2,943
Last seen: 11 months, 11 days
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Tangerines]
#388725 - 03/23/10 12:47 PM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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Quote:
Tangerines said:
Since when is health care and education a human right? It's a privilege. We shouldn't forget that. Thinking otherwise is taking things for granted.
No it's a right. Everyone should have access to education. Just like everyone should have access to food and clean water. A child born in Nigeria should have the same chances that a child born in America has.
Quote:
Tangerines said:What's next? Is driving a car a right? "No child left behind" we should give them all cars.
A car is not necessary to sustain life. Education, access to medical aid, food and clean water all are.
Quote:
Tangerines said:We can't save everyone and we should not want to save everyone.
Nope you definitely can't save EVERYONE. This isn't about saving people, it's about giving the helpless and severely poor a chance.
Quote:
Tangerines said:And just to clarify I did not grow up in a rich household. Just an average American household.
What does this have to do with anything? Your still extremely lucky and wealthy in my perspective. Your incredibly lucky at least compared to me.
Quote:
Tangerines said:
America is not "every other western country"... why do we have to play follow the leader?
Your country is not playing follow the leader. There are apparently a large number of people in your government that would like to see the United States become a civilized country.
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andyistic said:
Ok so let me bring you idiots up to speed.
The admins are tired of this shitfest being made the joke of the weed community on the Internet.
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Doitagain
Smoothie therapist
Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 7,226
Loc: i am everywhere and nowhe...
Last seen: 14 years, 5 months
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Tangerines]
#388726 - 03/23/10 12:51 PM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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Quote:
Tangerines said:
Just because every other western nation has done it does not mean it is progress...
no the fact that every other western nation has done it does not mean it is progress, the fact that every other western nation is able to provide healthcare for all it's citizens means its progress, and now we will too means its progress.
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ltd said:
fgts just don't understand
keep the shit
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Tangerines
Grease Wizard
Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 9,497
Last seen: 6 years, 5 months
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: TomCollins]
#388727 - 03/23/10 12:51 PM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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The only reason I seem wealthy is because my people worked their asses off to get to where we are. If people would actually put forth some effort and work to the bone they could afford the nice things in life.
Also, education is not needed to sustain life.
People do not have the right to take my money for their own use. That is what it comes down to for me. I have to foot the bill for people that I do not even know. I'd rather save the money and use it for when my family needs it. But no I can't do that anymore.
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