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But also the older lav that was pure purple in color... man I'd like that pure purple strain.

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Can u buy pollen anywhere that u think is worth a few bucks??

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Not that I know of. I stopped using males as much to make seeds a few years ago. The demand for feminized is to high.

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How many lumens per Sq ft does a male require?

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Can u flower males of diff varietys in sane room?

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Just collect pollen so it's not getting mixed together

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This og male is an F1 hybrid and I don't have access to the pollen that produced it. Im unsure if this male would preform as well as a stable male..

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Hard call. I've had it go both ways. I've had F1s that made killer seeds that grew killer plants. I've also had a trusted female that had been many times produce shit seeds(called shit seeds cause they produced shit plants) and the only difference was the male used and it was a F1.

Finding a stable male you're most likely gonna have to find yourself from seeds that come from a stable strain.

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Now I wonder if growing out males.indoors for breeding is even a good idea?

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I don't think there is anything wrong with it considering every major seed breeder has been doing it for years. I don't think you'd have any problem if that is what you are considering doing.

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I'm just thinking outdoor breeding you would have better success as far as seeing phenotypic expressions

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You know this makes complete sense but I've been under the lights since 1985 (yeah yeah get the old man jokes out of the way ) but haven't found it to be the case. I do believe that outdoor light is better but really haven't notice much of a difference in growth other then the overall size of the plants.

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On another note, these f1s come from known good females and known good males that stood out next to ten other males of the same variety

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Like I said before as long as You trust the source then use the male and I'm sure you'll make killer seeds.


I bred a strain called Man Eater and these are some of the results people here have had with it.

https://www.growery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/721313

https://www.growery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/750913

https://www.growery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/683676/page/1

https://www.growery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/478336

Results with some of my other gear

https://www.growery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/677420

https://www.growery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/422318

https://www.growery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/803449



What I do to make the seeds
Lets take Man Eater. In Man Eater I used a female Green Crack from the Amsterdam Collage in Oakland, CA. The Sour Diesel was a male from Reservoir Seeds.

1. Cross the Green Crack(P1) with the Sour Diesel(P1)

2. Take the seeds from the first cross (these will be F1s and are what you buy from seed dealers in Amsterdam) and get a good male and a good female from them.

3. Cross that male and the female to get seeds from them. These seeds will be F2s.

4. Take the best female you can find from the F2s and cross it to the original father plant(P1).

5. Now you have F3s. Take the best male plant you can find and cross it to the original mother plant(P1)

6. Now these seeds are stable. To test females and males from these seeds are crossed with each other to check for uniformity.

I use a male and a female from these seeds to make the seeds you get. This is why I can tell you exactly what the plants are going to do and they do it. This is also why I can very safely say if you cross any two of my seeds they will produce seeds exactly like the ones you bought. The plants from them will be exactly like the ones you just grew.

The process is done exactly the same way for the feminized seeds but time has to be taken to draw pollen from female plants.

I wish I could take credit for this method of stabilizing but I can't. Credit has to go to one of the best breeders on this planet Shantibaba from Mr. Nice Seeds.

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Grit said:
Hey, could you share any tips on how to select a good male for breeding? Can you just keep a male same way you keep a mother alive, and just take cuts from the male to use to breed with? Or do you flower the male out and keep the pollen?

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It's hard to pick a good male but it's done the same way as with a female. Smell, taste, speed of growth, flowering time(done by flowering a cutting off of the males to test em), and so on.

Yes you can keep a male alive and take cuttings from it to us when you want to flower for pollen. You could also do it the other way you mentioned and grow out the male and save the pollen. For making seeds though the fresher the pollen the better. They say pollen can be stored for years but myself I've never gone for more then 6 months.

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Grit said:
Hey, could you share any tips on how to select a good male for breeding? Can you just keep a male same way you keep a mother alive, and just take cuts from the male to use to breed with? Or do you flower the male out and keep the pollen?

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http://www.cannabisculture.com/content/2003/3/7/2788

I think what u r asking is if u need male pollen to breed crosses w or if u can graft male tissue to a female plant and get a cross correct? ?

Im not aware of grafting methods, and might imagine that one needs pollen to stabilize properly even if grating is doable. My best guess at least..

If u ever get a male plant that tends to shoot female flowers I'd love a cut tho lol

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So say I got a lavender Kush female,
crossed my male F1 og cross to the lavender female. So that would make my male F1 og cross actually my p1, and my lavendar kush female my p1.

Then took those seeds and find a mom and pop and Cross these two to get my f2s.

Then get the best mom from those seeds.. and cross that back to my original F1(in this case p1..) male...

Then u take these seeds get the best male and cross it back to the original p1 lav mom?

Would that be a three way cross? And make the seeds stable.

Then take the stable seeds get a mom and pop and Cross them into each other to test for uniformity. Then those seeds as long as they r uniform would be what u would five as a stable strain as u described?

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So that would make my male F1 og cross actually my p1, and my lavendar kush female my p1.

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Is that how u would normally do a three way cross? Start w F1 seeds then add another female or male as I described?

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Usually you cross 2 strains and get it stable then ad the 3rd strain.


Not as easy as it sounds sometimes. I have a strain named Sweet 16 that I bred for SOG grows that has little branching and a large main cola.

Took damn near 8 years to finish her.

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Imagine it wouldn't matter, just influences which genes are passed on right?

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You got it.

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It seems shorter than what I had in mind. I've barely touched on can cannabis genetics yet. Need to read a lot more.

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Yeah this is a good read


If you really want to get into it

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I wondered if seed banks sold their unstable seeds

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And shouldn't they be stable?

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So I've heard few diff things on fem seeds just haven't looked into cause I'm not so into it. I want males.

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So no spray on hormone or funny stuff?

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No hormone but there is spray that makes a hormone unusable by the plant which causes the female flowers to form male but when done right the plant never knows it's happening

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I'd love to trade when I get my strain going lol give me some yrs tho don't go anywhere lol

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Did u select for/ end up with the sour d funky diesel flavors or GC fruity Ness or??

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I'm very curious here about much hopefully don't mind

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Nope, I don't mind. I've always said if I can't answer questions then I shouldn't moderator. Also if I've never tried something I'll tell you and won't answer the question. I don't go by books or info alone I have to have tried it. (I'm not gonna be responsible for a fuckup in somebody's garden)

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would cloning the male out to and flowering the clone be wise? To ensure the male clones carry the traits.

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u will be cloning them. Males u won't clone normally so maybe this wouldn't be necessary

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Thanks for the replies mag u have helped  broaden my understanding of genetics I appreciate that a lot

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Blaaaaa.....you scratch my back I scratch yours. That's why we are all here. Believe me if I need info on Lavender Kush I'll be getting a hold of ya.

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Magash said:

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would cloning the male out to and flowering the clone be wise? To ensure the male clones carry the traits.

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Yes this is a killer idea. Flower out a male then discover it's killer and then have nothing to fall back of if you don't collect enough pollen or say down the line you catch yourself with a new killer female saying "damn I wish I still had that male it would go killer with this strain".

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u will be cloning them. Males u won't clone normally so maybe this wouldn't be necessary

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Remember that's most people not people that like to do experiments or want to come up with new strains and that is the category we fall into. I hate to say it like this but it's a step further in growing then the normal person who just grows for smoke.

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Thanks for the replies mag u have helped  broaden my understanding of genetics I appreciate that a lot

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Blaaaaa.....you scratch my back I scratch yours. That's why we are all here. Believe me if I need info on Lavender Kush I'll be getting a hold of ya.

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Let the games begin lol

I've been fascinated w herb since 13. Now at 26 after learning about fungi genetics somewhat here I am ready to dive head first into selective breeding. I'm so amped up lately lmao. I'll be posting often.

I'll prob start a grow log w the LK. I'm gonna start some blue knight and few more LK in a week or so.

Currently have several diff f1 crosses going, one LK, and some of "chico seeds"

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This male of mine has 11 leaves w an occasional 10 leaf mutation...

Is this common?

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Or is this simply a trait he carries?

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Yup, that's about it. Your gonna see something like that on a shitload of plants if you stay with growing.

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Do u think this will have an affect on the pollen and breeding qualities of the male? Would u use pollen grown in such a way?

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Nah the plant will be fine till the point that the light interupts flowering. What will happen then is a process called reverting where the plant leaves start to reduce the nmber of blaces till they get back to one blade a leaf like seedlings and then starts growing normally again. The process can slow things down by weeks.

Example: Had to be around 1987 or so when we had a room full of plant that needed sexing. We turned back the lights,  they showed signs and then they just froze for a few weeks then went into reverting. A lesson well learned. Should have taken cuttings and sexed those.

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Nevar44 said:
Nice thanks mag

So I'm guessing u do not put your plants into flower, to sex them?

Some people put their plant in flower for a week or so to sex it, then once it shows sex, they put it back into veg??

This hasn't ever made any sense to me...

Why not just wait till the dam thing shows its sex in veg??

It doesn't take very long to show sex in veg of u have a close eye...

About a month from seed is how long mine have been taking lately to how sex in veg

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Nah, I don't put them into flower to sex them but that was 1987 and we were just figuring things out. You should have seen the lights and hydro systems that were around at that time. Most everybody started every crop from seed cause we didn't know about taking cuttings yet. Was the early 90s before people were really taking cuttings with this new stuff that was just released called rockwool.

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Is it common to get hermie at the F1 stage?

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Or, if u were to get several hermies, or more than hermie... from those F1 seeds..

Would u consider those f1s bad and hermie prone??

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Or do u just weed out the non compatible phenos that hermed out??? And keep cracking those f1s until u get a nice plant that doesn't herm?

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Seems to me u wouldn't even wanna work with those seeds.

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Exactly. I add them to the bird seed.