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 phychotron
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Registered: 02/17/11
Posts: 1,995
Loc: Earth (mostly) 
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 Re: The Preferred Nutrient Solution of The Growery Community 2013.  [Re: hamloaf]
#690534 - 10/25/13 08:48 AM (11 years, 5 months ago) |
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I've switched to Canna when I went 100% coco, best move yet. I was with Advanced but they're were always problems with the plants, especially around the P-K boost-- flushing was always a bitch. I have a non-recirculating tank and the nutrients would form solids and have a bunch of crap after a few days of sitting. I emailed them for support but they wouldn't really address an issue over email, just phone (which I didn't have at the time, but they still refused to help via email.) I think thats because they don't want to put anything in writing that may be negative about their product. 12 PH.D's to develop the formula, but what they don't tell you is that 11 of those are in marketing--full line is 17 bottles give or take a few depending on what they have to pull off the shelf from time to time.
Its hard to find at most stores but Canna is the simplest nutrient line I've seen, A+B and zym, PK one week, Boost(flavor, speed) in flower but optional, rhizo when your rooting, also optional but recommended. Thats it. I'll mix it up pretty much full strength the whole time during flower, with a few random days of plain water, but its only at around 800ppm's and the plants love it. Flushing got much easier also. The leaf tips might show signs of a little bit of burn after a few weeks but never a real problem after a day or so of plain water.
Silica is single-handedly the best additive I've tried, I recommend everyone add it to their regime. Strengthens the plant cells and protects against insects and environment. It will help keep your buds from sagging over when they get top heavy.
Pretty much everyone here has started with the pH adjust kit from GH. They work but eventually become a pain in the ass. I've only had to use the pH+ when I overshot the pH-, but rarely, and I would usually just add more water instead. Advanced makes a good/strong pH-, especially compared to GH's liquid and powder.
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Any help given is for educational purposes only. Its your responsibility not to break any applicable laws
 Bamboo Bongs I make | Perfect Dry and Cure | Grapegod under LED
“Human beings, vegetables, or cosmic dust, we all dance to a mysterious tune intoned in the distance by an invisible player.” ~ Albert Einstein
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phychotron
Medicated
Registered: 02/17/11
Posts: 1,995
Loc: Earth (mostly)
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Re: The Preferred Nutrient Solution of The Growery Community 2013. [Re: Hawksresurrection]
#690565 - 10/25/13 02:05 PM (11 years, 5 months ago) |
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and their soil will give you a shit ton of fungus gnats...
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Any help given is for educational purposes only. Its your responsibility not to break any applicable laws
Bamboo Bongs I make | Perfect Dry and Cure | Grapegod under LED
“Human beings, vegetables, or cosmic dust, we all dance to a mysterious tune intoned in the distance by an invisible player.” ~ Albert Einstein
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phychotron
Medicated
Registered: 02/17/11
Posts: 1,995
Loc: Earth (mostly)
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Re: The Preferred Nutrient Solution of The Growery Community 2013. [Re: Hawksresurrection]
#690581 - 10/25/13 04:34 PM (11 years, 5 months ago) |
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Agreed, I told a guy at a hydro store I wanted to foliar feed nitrogen to help boost the plants in early veg, he handed me the pure N 16-0-0 but it didn't say anything about foliar, guy at the store said it should work, its nitrogen. So I emailed them and they said its not recommended because its too hot.
Which reminds me...
A much better foliar spray that I use now is the Humboldt Nutrients Verde @ 16-1-2, which is a more rounded product that has Magnesium Iron and Zinc, which are commonly deficient. Some things may not deficient in soil but hard for the plant to transport upward, I think Mg is one of those, maybe even the other two.
I only foliar spray when they're just starting to get into the coco from the cloner and they don't have any nutrients in the medium, and occasionally in veg to green up the leaves a bit. Maybe once or twice I might add it to the nutrient tank in veg.
So my master formula right now is
Canna's 2-part Coco plus additives planted in pure coco, Gro-Tek's Pro-silicate, Humboldt Nutrients' Verde, Advanced Nutrients pH down. Drip fed via Blumats, two per 5 gallon pot. Superthive in the aerocloner for IBA. I'm pretty satisfied with this combination, its pretty rock solid, and not over complicated. I can't think of anything else the plants might need, except more light.
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Any help given is for educational purposes only. Its your responsibility not to break any applicable laws
Bamboo Bongs I make | Perfect Dry and Cure | Grapegod under LED
“Human beings, vegetables, or cosmic dust, we all dance to a mysterious tune intoned in the distance by an invisible player.” ~ Albert Einstein
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phychotron
Medicated
Registered: 02/17/11
Posts: 1,995
Loc: Earth (mostly)
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Re: The Preferred Nutrient Solution of The Growery Community 2013. [Re: Tank333]
#690697 - 10/26/13 06:39 AM (11 years, 5 months ago) |
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They are kinda packed in there, but I try and keep them from being too smashed up together.
I was thinking of doing 3 or 4 blumats to even out the watering.
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Any help given is for educational purposes only. Its your responsibility not to break any applicable laws
Bamboo Bongs I make | Perfect Dry and Cure | Grapegod under LED
“Human beings, vegetables, or cosmic dust, we all dance to a mysterious tune intoned in the distance by an invisible player.” ~ Albert Einstein
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phychotron
Medicated
Registered: 02/17/11
Posts: 1,995
Loc: Earth (mostly)
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Re: The Preferred Nutrient Solution of The Growery Community 2013. [Re: hamloaf]
#691018 - 10/29/13 10:20 AM (11 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
hamloaf said:
Right now I'm rockin' the Fertilome brand Fish Emulsion (5-1-1) for veg. It's doing the trick. Like what I'm hearing about this Botanicare brand nutes. That's crazy about Roots. Got a buddy who's rockin the Roots. He got the little "Players Package" and he's in love with em'. That brand Canna you're talking about sounds familiar. They are outta Humboldt county, aren't they? Back in 08' as I quit growing there was this new brand of nutrient coming out of Homboldt that I remember thinking I wanted to try and at the time remember thinking was in the same league as Advanced Nutrients but can't remember the name of it. Remember wanting to switch to it though because they we're made in my native land of America.
Good lookin' grow, btw, I'll tell you hhhwhat. 
Canna is a Dutch company thats been around since the early 90's. They came along and basically revolutionized the use of coco coir in hydroponics. They came out with their last product, Boost, in 2008; it might have been talked about for awhile.
I think they're are 2 Humboldt brands out there now. Humboldt nutrients, which seems pretty good so far and another that I've heard from a few people that it sucked.
Any nutrient line should work if you use it long enough and figure out its magic formula.
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Any help given is for educational purposes only. Its your responsibility not to break any applicable laws
Bamboo Bongs I make | Perfect Dry and Cure | Grapegod under LED
“Human beings, vegetables, or cosmic dust, we all dance to a mysterious tune intoned in the distance by an invisible player.” ~ Albert Einstein
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phychotron
Medicated
Registered: 02/17/11
Posts: 1,995
Loc: Earth (mostly)
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Re: The Preferred Nutrient Solution of The Growery Community 2013. [Re: hamloaf]
#692276 - 11/06/13 02:29 PM (11 years, 4 months ago) |
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Awesome, I hear nothing but good things about Botanicare.
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Any help given is for educational purposes only. Its your responsibility not to break any applicable laws
Bamboo Bongs I make | Perfect Dry and Cure | Grapegod under LED
“Human beings, vegetables, or cosmic dust, we all dance to a mysterious tune intoned in the distance by an invisible player.” ~ Albert Einstein
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phychotron
Medicated
Registered: 02/17/11
Posts: 1,995
Loc: Earth (mostly)
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Re: The Preferred Nutrient Solution of The Growery Community 2013. [Re: 13buds]
#692583 - 11/08/13 02:45 AM (11 years, 4 months ago) |
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I'd say avoid AN also, they're a pain in the ass to use. I like their pH adjust, but their nutrients don't hold up in my tank (non-recirculating, just sitting by themselves) They say their formula was made by 12 Ph.D.'s but what they don't say is that 11 of them are in marketing. How do you make a few extra million a year? Sell them 17 products to complete the full line of nutrients--some stuff at $400 per gallon. They have an idea where your money is from and know some people wont mind throwing a few extra bucks down at the hydro store thinking they need it for the bomb bud.
I'd go with Botanicare before AN.
As for organics, it seems like there are not too many good liquid organic nutrients out there. I decided its not needed and stop researching it. My brother was using AN's Iguana and I liked his plants in veg and smoked/tasted good but wasn't maxing out the yield. Hard to say if it works that well because he never kept up with it. From what I read online it seems like the people who do go liquid organic liked it a lot.
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Any help given is for educational purposes only. Its your responsibility not to break any applicable laws
Bamboo Bongs I make | Perfect Dry and Cure | Grapegod under LED
“Human beings, vegetables, or cosmic dust, we all dance to a mysterious tune intoned in the distance by an invisible player.” ~ Albert Einstein
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phychotron
Medicated
Registered: 02/17/11
Posts: 1,995
Loc: Earth (mostly)
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Re: The Preferred Nutrient Solution of The Growery Community 2013. [Re: Midgetpawn] 2
#710771 - 01/31/14 08:41 AM (11 years, 2 months ago) |
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Every liquid nutrient has water as its main ingredient, its the solvent, the nutrients are its solute.
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Any help given is for educational purposes only. Its your responsibility not to break any applicable laws
Bamboo Bongs I make | Perfect Dry and Cure | Grapegod under LED
“Human beings, vegetables, or cosmic dust, we all dance to a mysterious tune intoned in the distance by an invisible player.” ~ Albert Einstein
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phychotron
Medicated
Registered: 02/17/11
Posts: 1,995
Loc: Earth (mostly)
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Re: The Preferred Nutrient Solution of The Growery Community 2013. [Re: Midgetpawn] 1
#710995 - 02/02/14 08:23 AM (11 years, 2 months ago) |
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Canna is a type of flower  and were growing flowers... get it?
If you specifically say your nutrients are made for bud then you are conspiring with the grower to break federal laws. Advanced Nutrients has had problems in the past by saying they're for bud, so they started advertising it more on the down low. Their website should not have anything about cannabis, unless its changed in the last few years.
Just like how Tommy Chong got busted for selling smoking equipment, they can be bitches if you specifically say its for something illegal. "its not a bong, its a chong" but bong being a marijuana inhalation device vs Water pipe, is a 'tobacco' pipe. If you said the B-word in a glass shop 10 years ago you'd risk getting kicked out, gotta ask to see that "water pipe." One of the local glass shops enforces the no B-word policy, the other is run by a stoner who has no concern for the old ways, even starting up bud conversations with customers. Obviously Chong's case was a bit more complicated than that, but its all about INTENT.
Edit: I found one thing about cannabis on the AN "about" page. "We have been at the biggest medical and general marijuana events." Thats it.
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Any help given is for educational purposes only. Its your responsibility not to break any applicable laws
Bamboo Bongs I make | Perfect Dry and Cure | Grapegod under LED
“Human beings, vegetables, or cosmic dust, we all dance to a mysterious tune intoned in the distance by an invisible player.” ~ Albert Einstein
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phychotron
Medicated
Registered: 02/17/11
Posts: 1,995
Loc: Earth (mostly)
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Re: The Preferred Nutrient Solution of The Growery Community 2013. [Re: Midgetpawn]
#711043 - 02/02/14 03:13 PM (11 years, 1 month ago) |
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They have a lot of restrictions for labeling nutrients, making it hard to even claim your product does anything. Advanced Nutrients and Oregon have a long history of labeling disputes, as well as with other states. Its why a lot of product information is so vague; it cost to much to get government approval of actual claims. Its because the department of agriculture is really strict from people selling snake oil to farmers back in the day.
You can pretty much figure that most all of the liquid nutrients out there are geared toward cannabis to begin with, so you don't really need them to say it. It also makes your brand less universal for that random actual tomato gardener who might pass on it.
Its just a matter of time before they put actual pot plants on the bottle, not just the semi pot resembling leaf you see on a bunch out there.
Advanced already markets to you the way that you want, big bud, overdrive, bud candy, etc.
I see that they have a product now called Kushie Kush that is being promoted as a medical-bud specific nutrient. They must be getting more ballsy as medical laws are progressing.
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Any help given is for educational purposes only. Its your responsibility not to break any applicable laws
Bamboo Bongs I make | Perfect Dry and Cure | Grapegod under LED
“Human beings, vegetables, or cosmic dust, we all dance to a mysterious tune intoned in the distance by an invisible player.” ~ Albert Einstein
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phychotron
Medicated
Registered: 02/17/11
Posts: 1,995
Loc: Earth (mostly)
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Re: The Preferred Nutrient Solution of The Growery Community 2013. [Re: Midgetpawn]
#711101 - 02/02/14 09:10 PM (11 years, 1 month ago) |
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This country has wronged black people for so long that they need to raise awareness to the social cruelties set upon them as well as their cultural influence. The achievements of the few refute the traditional held belief that blacks are in fact inferior and are therefor showcased as what is possible if they are allowed to assimilate into white society. Black history all year would just drown out the issue; once a year allows you to revisit the issue safely, but time and again so that your opinion matures with you. The entire month almost ensures that you think about the issue at least once.
But lets not get too off topic here, there are other forums for that sort of discussion.
I'm sure one day there will be a product like Miracle Grow for bud just like they have one for tomatoes, its just a matter of time before its legal enough for someone to do it.
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Any help given is for educational purposes only. Its your responsibility not to break any applicable laws
Bamboo Bongs I make | Perfect Dry and Cure | Grapegod under LED
“Human beings, vegetables, or cosmic dust, we all dance to a mysterious tune intoned in the distance by an invisible player.” ~ Albert Einstein
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phychotron
Medicated
Registered: 02/17/11
Posts: 1,995
Loc: Earth (mostly)
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Re: The Preferred Nutrient Solution of The Growery Community 2013. [Re: Midgetpawn] 1
#711439 - 02/04/14 10:46 AM (11 years, 1 month ago) |
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You'll find every company jives about how their PK formula is the real correct ratio. And its never a sales pitch, its all based on "research"
Nutrients are not that expensive, my last crop cost $2.42 per ounce in nutrients, with $0.79/Oz in base nutrients. Its not that I don't know that its cheaper to build my own nutrients, its just that the pain in the ass of setting up my own nutrient line, and not worth it when liquid nutrients are that cheap.
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Any help given is for educational purposes only. Its your responsibility not to break any applicable laws
Bamboo Bongs I make | Perfect Dry and Cure | Grapegod under LED
“Human beings, vegetables, or cosmic dust, we all dance to a mysterious tune intoned in the distance by an invisible player.” ~ Albert Einstein
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phychotron
Medicated
Registered: 02/17/11
Posts: 1,995
Loc: Earth (mostly)
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Re: The Preferred Nutrient Solution of The Growery Community 2013. [Re: Harry_Ba11sach]
#711518 - 02/04/14 04:20 PM (11 years, 1 month ago) |
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You'll find that a lot of products are priced toward the intended application. For Example, in Walmart they had the EXACT same knife sharpener in the outdoor section for $6 as the kitchen section for $25, just a different color. Trying to sell an outdoor/camping sharpener that your going to use occasionally is harder to sell for $25, but they might sell you a kitchen sharpener that you'll use all the with no problem.
Millions of things are packaged and marketed differently because of it. They charge you for application when they know what your going to do with it. Chemicals especially since those are harder to figure out which one you might need to replace it with if they just called it "windex" or something like that. If you know the base ingredients they're a lot cheaper because there is no specific application they can jack you for.
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Any help given is for educational purposes only. Its your responsibility not to break any applicable laws
Bamboo Bongs I make | Perfect Dry and Cure | Grapegod under LED
“Human beings, vegetables, or cosmic dust, we all dance to a mysterious tune intoned in the distance by an invisible player.” ~ Albert Einstein
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phychotron
Medicated
Registered: 02/17/11
Posts: 1,995
Loc: Earth (mostly)
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Re: The Preferred Nutrient Solution of The Growery Community 2013. [Re: phychotron]
#711522 - 02/04/14 04:37 PM (11 years, 1 month ago) |
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Its everything, even the paper cup-cake liners. They sell them both in the plastic bag aisle and baking section at different prices and different qty per package so that you have a hard time trying to figure out which one is cheapest per count. Anything that is sold in multiple places throughout the store are most vulnerable: multi-department = multi-packaging = multi-pricing. Seriously, watch out.
Sometimes whole stores are dedicated to specific application, such as hydro stores, but they wouldn't be able to stay in business if they sold the base nutrient powders at rock bottom prices. You'd get your 50lb bags of nutrients that would last you 20 years and never come back. It has to be worth their time to make it and sell it, and therefor must require a profit. The multiple product lines ensures competition so that prices don't get too out of hand. Plus paying a company to develop nutrients and keep up with the current science is worth it.
It really comes down to how much your time is worth or how large of an operation you have. Is it worth the time and space to mix and store all these chemicals around your house? If you have a commercial size operation then its probably worth it to mix your own, but I live in an apartment, I can't just keep a bunch of raw ingredients around. I'm really glad that I can just hand someone $2.50 per ounce for the nutrients to be mixed up and guaranteed to perform, tested for quality, etc. I don't want to come home after a long day and think "OK lets bust out some chemistry real quick then I can finally get to bed."
It seems like it would be fun to learn and do, and probably not THAT hard if your situated for it, but its so hard to break a good system to experiment with saving $30-40 every few months. My time is worth more than that at this point.
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Any help given is for educational purposes only. Its your responsibility not to break any applicable laws
Bamboo Bongs I make | Perfect Dry and Cure | Grapegod under LED
“Human beings, vegetables, or cosmic dust, we all dance to a mysterious tune intoned in the distance by an invisible player.” ~ Albert Einstein
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