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 phychotron
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Registered: 02/17/11
Posts: 1,995
Loc: Earth (mostly) 
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 Re: Cloning  [Re: PoloDown]
#668957 - 05/03/13 11:16 AM (11 years, 11 months ago) |
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aerocloners are by far the best and most affordable option. You can build one for around $40, then it only takes a few pennies per time.
I use what is called the "scrape technique" and just add about 1ml/gal of Superthrive (its IBA-the rooting hormone and B vitamins) or other IBA containing product. Hella roots in 3-12 days, depending on the daily/nightly temps.
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Any help given is for educational purposes only. Its your responsibility not to break any applicable laws
 Bamboo Bongs I make | Perfect Dry and Cure | Grapegod under LED
“Human beings, vegetables, or cosmic dust, we all dance to a mysterious tune intoned in the distance by an invisible player.” ~ Albert Einstein
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phychotron
Medicated
Registered: 02/17/11
Posts: 1,995
Loc: Earth (mostly)
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Re: Cloning [Re: PoloDown]
#669044 - 05/03/13 06:09 PM (11 years, 11 months ago) |
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don't put any nutrients in the water. Not until the roots have already started to grow. Even then, I like to transplant early like when shown.
I go into coco using the 1L Airpots. those 1L 'aircells' as they call them, are amazing, and probably one of the best investments you can make for young plants. They way they are setup allows them to transplant very very well, lots of root tips just waiting to go, not swirled at the bottom, but dozens of points sticking out.
The larger airpots might not be worth it, compared to bags (but they're rigid and work very well), but the 1L are worth the $2.50.
these here in the front:
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Any help given is for educational purposes only. Its your responsibility not to break any applicable laws
Bamboo Bongs I make | Perfect Dry and Cure | Grapegod under LED
“Human beings, vegetables, or cosmic dust, we all dance to a mysterious tune intoned in the distance by an invisible player.” ~ Albert Einstein
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phychotron
Medicated
Registered: 02/17/11
Posts: 1,995
Loc: Earth (mostly)
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Re: Cloning [Re: PoloDown]
#669065 - 05/03/13 07:53 PM (11 years, 11 months ago) |
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Nutrients just tend to cause problems before it roots. They don't need salts/nutrition--they cant absorb any, they need rooting hormone. You could run plain water, and I've had decent results with just that, but if you keep it simple with a little IBA based product you can have it last a few weeks(months) without having to change the water. Depends on how your stuff looks after awhile, but if it feels/smells like normal water then i'll leave it.
Do you scrape at all? take a fresh razor and drag is sideways down the bottom ~inch of the stem in 2-3 spots to take the outermost layer of cells off.
I have the 15 minute interval timer, so I do 15/30 on/off, sometimes 15/15, but it depends on the time of year, if its getting too warm/cold, I'll let the pump run more/less often to keep the temperature. Not sure of the exact temp of the water, but its lukewarm when it's working the best. I have a seedling heat mat taped around it for the winter.
That 5 gallon bucket with 13 sites can take around 50 clones. You can put 3-4 cuts into one collar, they have the t shape, then just don't let the roots get tangled up, its why I'm transplanting when they first show up like that, but also once they get to that point they take to the coco/aircells well.
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Any help given is for educational purposes only. Its your responsibility not to break any applicable laws
Bamboo Bongs I make | Perfect Dry and Cure | Grapegod under LED
“Human beings, vegetables, or cosmic dust, we all dance to a mysterious tune intoned in the distance by an invisible player.” ~ Albert Einstein
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phychotron
Medicated
Registered: 02/17/11
Posts: 1,995
Loc: Earth (mostly)
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Re: Cloning [Re: PoloDown]
#669099 - 05/04/13 01:28 AM (11 years, 11 months ago) |
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if your IBA is in the water then you wont need to dip, just scrape and put in while the pump is running, they will get the stuff. gel might be easier to dip first if thats what you have.
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Any help given is for educational purposes only. Its your responsibility not to break any applicable laws
Bamboo Bongs I make | Perfect Dry and Cure | Grapegod under LED
“Human beings, vegetables, or cosmic dust, we all dance to a mysterious tune intoned in the distance by an invisible player.” ~ Albert Einstein
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phychotron
Medicated
Registered: 02/17/11
Posts: 1,995
Loc: Earth (mostly)
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Re: Cloning [Re: Angus]
#669177 - 05/04/13 04:10 PM (11 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
Angus said:
Surprised to hear people say aero cloners are "cheapest" or "simplest". I can't think of a more expensive or complicated way to clone.
The results that you get in just a few days, and the explosion of roots makes your plants grow and take much faster. Using most other methods will allow you to save money on materials/up front costs, but if you value the way the plants take root, it is the best for the price. I have only seen mediocre root growth, usually just one or two out of the root cubes or soil at first, it takes an extra few weeks for those plants to catch up. Try counting the roots that you get out of the aerocloner, its almost impossible sometimes.
You eliminate the uncertainty of rooting, no question of weather its rooting or not. I've gone weeks only to find that they are just sitting in the cube/soil not doing shit.
You get more bang for your buck with an aerocloner.
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Any help given is for educational purposes only. Its your responsibility not to break any applicable laws
Bamboo Bongs I make | Perfect Dry and Cure | Grapegod under LED
“Human beings, vegetables, or cosmic dust, we all dance to a mysterious tune intoned in the distance by an invisible player.” ~ Albert Einstein
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phychotron
Medicated
Registered: 02/17/11
Posts: 1,995
Loc: Earth (mostly)
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Re: Cloning [Re: PoloDown]
#669192 - 05/04/13 05:11 PM (11 years, 10 months ago) |
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IBA is the rooting hormone most common to those rooting products. You can use RO water and whichever root stimulator you can find. You can sometimes find it as low as $5 for powder at many garden sections of stores. I use Superthrive (IBA and B vitamins) because I had it around, but its pretty cheap and works very well, better than Olivia's cloning gel, the $10 bottle has lasted me a few years. They also make a $5 bottle of it. It also holds up well in the water for a few weeks. As for running 24/7, I find that the pump heats the water too much. The 15 minute interval timer works to control heat, and it seems to work better with a wet/dry cycle.
Some useless information:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indole-3-butyric_acid
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Any help given is for educational purposes only. Its your responsibility not to break any applicable laws
Bamboo Bongs I make | Perfect Dry and Cure | Grapegod under LED
“Human beings, vegetables, or cosmic dust, we all dance to a mysterious tune intoned in the distance by an invisible player.” ~ Albert Einstein
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phychotron
Medicated
Registered: 02/17/11
Posts: 1,995
Loc: Earth (mostly)
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Re: Cloning [Re: Magash]
#669199 - 05/04/13 05:37 PM (11 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
Magash said:
Not seeing rooting as fast as a aero cloner or as much rooting then you need to modify your tech.
Its not just my tech, its almost everyone's clone's I've seen. Its easier to teach someone how to make an aerocloner than it is to explain to everyone how to get the optimal growth conditions for cloning, and then have them to actually achieve that. Its about $50 to make the one I use, but it automates the whole thing.
Three weeks in an aerocloner and they would still have more roots than those. This photo was taken 27 days after being cut off the plant.
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Any help given is for educational purposes only. Its your responsibility not to break any applicable laws
Bamboo Bongs I make | Perfect Dry and Cure | Grapegod under LED
“Human beings, vegetables, or cosmic dust, we all dance to a mysterious tune intoned in the distance by an invisible player.” ~ Albert Einstein
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phychotron
Medicated
Registered: 02/17/11
Posts: 1,995
Loc: Earth (mostly)
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Re: Cloning [Re: PoloDown]
#669203 - 05/04/13 05:48 PM (11 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
PoloDown said:
Would you say the results are equal if I use root hormone gel/powder and RO water vs nutrients in the water? By running 24/7 I meant that I either have to run plain water or nutrient water but not both since I change all the time.
no nutrients in the cloner until they are rooted, then you generally will want to change the water before taking more cuttings to put in. You can use just water, but its usually faster with a rooting hormone. If you are just using the rooting gel/powder then you can let your water sit longer, just take the clones out before the roots get massive. Let the rooting period be a rooting period, not a nutrient period. It has all the stuff it needs to get started, you can feed it lightly when you transplant it.
Every time I, or someone else I've seen use nutrients before they root has some discoloration and usually not as fast as with just the root hormone. Maybe you can find the magic blend, but its better to keep it simple.
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Any help given is for educational purposes only. Its your responsibility not to break any applicable laws
Bamboo Bongs I make | Perfect Dry and Cure | Grapegod under LED
“Human beings, vegetables, or cosmic dust, we all dance to a mysterious tune intoned in the distance by an invisible player.” ~ Albert Einstein
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phychotron
Medicated
Registered: 02/17/11
Posts: 1,995
Loc: Earth (mostly)
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Re: Cloning [Re: PoloDown]
#669288 - 05/05/13 11:09 AM (11 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
PoloDown said:
Great posts going on lots of information here!!
Would you guys say those 1 liter air pots do as good or better then a 1 gallon bag or pot?
For the airpots the 1L are by far the best investment. The larger the airpot the less you'll notice any difference over a cloth bag. The small 1L are great for prepping it to transplant to a large pot--the roots are in prime location for invading the soil as soon as it gets planted.
I only use them for about 2-3 weeks until they get roots like mad, then transplant them. Even In coco they don't have huge watering requirement for the first few weeks. Watering gets done with a small 2L water spout that gets right in the center. The tall sided trays are coincidental, they just happen to be in my closet, work perfectly, and accept the run off. Sometimes I'll leave some water in the bottom for a few days if they're going really fast.
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Any help given is for educational purposes only. Its your responsibility not to break any applicable laws
Bamboo Bongs I make | Perfect Dry and Cure | Grapegod under LED
“Human beings, vegetables, or cosmic dust, we all dance to a mysterious tune intoned in the distance by an invisible player.” ~ Albert Einstein
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phychotron
Medicated
Registered: 02/17/11
Posts: 1,995
Loc: Earth (mostly)
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Re: Cloning [Re: PoloDown]
#669333 - 05/05/13 04:56 PM (11 years, 10 months ago) |
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I got mine from rogue hydro.com, they are listed as .3 gal now, but they look the same. $2.50 each is the best price I was able to find a year ago from them, probably still the cheapest. Looks like they have free shipping now too.
By grow bags do you mean plastic disposable or cloth? I'm not too fond of those plastic bags for very long, only when I need to hold a plant for awhile. I'd go with rigid plastic before I go back to the soft bags.
You could flower in the 1L, but I'd want a flood table or some sort of automatic watering, they're going to dry up fast in flower. I can't vouch for how well they would work that way, but I think the way I use them is the best route with them--prepping for transplant.
Sorry OP, we kinda hijacked the thread with the airpots, but still valuable info nonetheless.
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Any help given is for educational purposes only. Its your responsibility not to break any applicable laws
Bamboo Bongs I make | Perfect Dry and Cure | Grapegod under LED
“Human beings, vegetables, or cosmic dust, we all dance to a mysterious tune intoned in the distance by an invisible player.” ~ Albert Einstein
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