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 TomCollins
Registered: 10/06/09
Posts: 2,943
Last seen: 11 months, 12 days
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 Another glorious victory against vegans! 
#657879 - 02/07/13 12:17 PM (11 years, 9 months ago) |
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Aaahhh! I love scientific inquiry, especially when it backhands the most logically absent mantras on healthy diet and lifestyle.
Quote:
Methods: Interventions Replacement of dietary saturated fats (from animal fats, common margarines, and shortenings) with omega 6 linoleic acid (from safflower oil and safflower oil polyunsaturated margarine). Controls received no specific dietary instruction or study foods. All non-dietary aspects were designed to be equivalent in both groups.
Conclusion: In this cohort, substituting dietary linoleic acid in place of saturated fats increased the rates of death from all causes, coronary heart disease, and cardiovascular disease.
Here is a list of poly-unsaturated fats, percentage indicates increase in risk of CHD and CVD compared to saturated fat from butter and lard.
Quote:
Salicornia oil - 75%
Safflower oil - 74.62%
Evening Primrose oil - 73%
Poppyseed oil - 70%
Grape seed oil - 69.6%
Sunflower oil - 65.7%
Hemp oil - 60%
Corn oil - 59%
Wheat germ oil - 55%
Cottonseed oil - 54%
Soybean oil - 51%
Walnut oil - 51%
Sesame oil - 45%
Rice bran oil - 39%
Argan oil - 37%
Pistachio oil - 32.7%
Peanut oil - 32%
Almonds - 24%
Canola oil - 21%
Chicken fat - 18-23%
Too bad about the hemp. We could burn some of these oils probably.
It seems like good ol butter is here to save the day, by making our hearts healthy beating machines!
But on a more serious note, be very careful around your health professionals, especially if they try to give you advice with diet or lifestyle.
Whenever my doctors give me advice, I always question it and read whatever academic literature on the internet I can.
The relationship between cannabis and psychiatric disorders for example, is not positive at all, but the methodology of the studies is idiotic - the studies don't actually prove anything because in many cases, there are huge confounders.
This is the case in nutrition too. For a while people thought coffee was unhealthy and causes cancer, until they discovered lots of coffee drinkers smoke cigarettes and there are still people around who think saturated fat clogs arteries.
These are some of the people giving you advice on how to be healthy and what to feed your children.
It's because of this that the last 60 years of health policy in the west, has resulted in an ocean of blistering hemorrhaging blobs for people, of which we're all aware.
So please, if you know a vegan, a vegetarian or anyone that follows either a low-fat, high-fiber or the American Diabetes Association recommended diet eat a stick of butter in front of them and if they so much as say anything, give them this link:
http://www.bmj.com/content/346/bmj.e8707
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andyistic said:
Ok so let me bring you idiots up to speed.
The admins are tired of this shitfest being made the joke of the weed community on the Internet.
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 drawde
Registered: 11/15/09
Posts: 5,268
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Re: Another glorious victory against vegans! [Re: TomCollins]
#657884 - 02/07/13 01:27 PM (11 years, 9 months ago) |
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Fail to see how this proves anything Spencer.
Also a little thought, you should thank each and every one of us for lowering the demand for your dietary content thereby decreasing cost. There are only so much resources to go around. Some day we may all be vegans, choice or not.
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King Koopa said:
The amount of pot that Gask smokes is equivalent to a guy shooting heroin on weekends
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Nothing Is
Registered: 05/02/08
Posts: 646
Last seen: 7 months, 20 days
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Re: Another glorious victory against vegans! [Re: TomCollins] 1
#657885 - 02/07/13 01:27 PM (11 years, 9 months ago) |
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Just because you're vegan doesn't mean it's wise to eat too much vegetable oils. But a responsible vegan diet beats the bullshit most Americans eat and I don't need a study to know that's right.
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TomCollins
Registered: 10/06/09
Posts: 2,943
Last seen: 11 months, 12 days
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Re: Another glorious victory against vegans! [Re: drawde]
#657908 - 02/07/13 02:31 PM (11 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
drawde said:
Fail to see how this proves anything Spencer.
 Did you read the study? lol I don't know how it could be more clear.
No but srsly, what I'm showing here is that many health professionals (doctors, epidemiologists, nutritionists, health workers, social policy makers, bob marleys, etc) are just as misinformed as the people they're trying to help, and our model for scientific inquiry has severe flaws in this field. This has led to massive population wide problems, but we all know this.
But also, if this flew over your head, the other reason I posted this was to inform the community about possible misinformation they may believe. So in that effect, I'm doing a public service and you should thank me - but you don't have to! 
Quote:
drawde said:
Also a little thought, you should thank each and every one of us for lowering the demand for your dietary content thereby decreasing cost. There are only so much resources to go around. Some day we may all be vegans, choice or not.
You (along with others) are lowering the demand of my dietary content? Butter and meat? Fruits and veggies? 
Do you even know where you are right now? 
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andyistic said:
Ok so let me bring you idiots up to speed.
The admins are tired of this shitfest being made the joke of the weed community on the Internet.
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TomCollins
Registered: 10/06/09
Posts: 2,943
Last seen: 11 months, 12 days
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Re: Another glorious victory against vegans! [Re: TomCollins]
#657909 - 02/07/13 02:32 PM (11 years, 9 months ago) |
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andyistic said:
Ok so let me bring you idiots up to speed.
The admins are tired of this shitfest being made the joke of the weed community on the Internet.
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drawde
Registered: 11/15/09
Posts: 5,268
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Re: Another glorious victory against vegans! [Re: TomCollins]
#657910 - 02/07/13 02:40 PM (11 years, 9 months ago) |
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It doesn't prove anything about vegetarianism/veganism... its about specific types of oils, not sure how that could be any more clear. There are a substantial amount of other factors to take into consideration before drawing such a correlation, of which the study does not do.
By choosing not to consume animal products, which are the most expensive kind to begin with, I lower the demand and increase the supply... basic economics- cheaper for those who do consume those products.
Edited by drawde (02/07/13 02:56 PM)
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drawde
Registered: 11/15/09
Posts: 5,268
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Re: Another glorious victory against vegans! [Re: drawde]
#657911 - 02/07/13 02:43 PM (11 years, 9 months ago) |
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Also I don't understand the sample population chosen, seems like they need some control groups.
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King Koopa said:
The amount of pot that Gask smokes is equivalent to a guy shooting heroin on weekends
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Magash
The Feminizer
Registered: 04/21/08
Posts: 6,634
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Re: Another glorious victory against vegans! [Re: TomCollins]
#657912 - 02/07/13 02:45 PM (11 years, 9 months ago) |
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Here we go on this stupid argument again on which diet is the best I see it coming.
It's as simple as this. We live in America folks (most of us here do anyway) the rule here is, it doesn't matter what you eat as long as you eat to much of it.
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All creatures tremble when faced with violence. All creatures fear death, all love life. If we can only see ourselves in others, then how could we possibly hurt another creature?
 Join us at the Growery!
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drawde
Registered: 11/15/09
Posts: 5,268
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Re: Another glorious victory against vegans! [Re: TomCollins]
#657914 - 02/07/13 02:52 PM (11 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
Spency said:
Also, veganism will always be a choice:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/In_vitro_meat
For the affluent
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King Koopa said:
The amount of pot that Gask smokes is equivalent to a guy shooting heroin on weekends
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drawde
Registered: 11/15/09
Posts: 5,268
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Re: Another glorious victory against vegans! [Re: Magash]
#657916 - 02/07/13 02:54 PM (11 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
Magash said:
Here we go on this stupid argument again on which diet is the best I see it coming.
It's as simple as this. We live in America folks (most of us here do anyway) the rule here is, it doesn't matter what you eat as long as you eat to much of it.
Nah man.. this is about a study.
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King Koopa said:
The amount of pot that Gask smokes is equivalent to a guy shooting heroin on weekends
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TomCollins
Registered: 10/06/09
Posts: 2,943
Last seen: 11 months, 12 days
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Re: Another glorious victory against vegans! [Re: Magash]
#657917 - 02/07/13 02:55 PM (11 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
drawde said:
Also I don't understand the sample population chosen, seems like they need some control groups.
They had one experimental and a control. It's right in the abstract!
Quote:
Magash said:
Here we go on this stupid argument again on which diet is the best I see it coming.
lolsy... so much hostility....
I mean I don't know what dwardes talking about but I posted about the controversy behind poly vs saturated fats, and just added in a personal annotation about epidemio-history.
Anyway, back on topic...
It's just amusing that the worst tasting oils are also the most toxic, but they're marketed as safe alternatives. It's really terrible and we should be cautious!
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andyistic said:
Ok so let me bring you idiots up to speed.
The admins are tired of this shitfest being made the joke of the weed community on the Internet.
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drawde
Registered: 11/15/09
Posts: 5,268
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Re: Another glorious victory against vegans! [Re: TomCollins]
#657918 - 02/07/13 03:00 PM (11 years, 9 months ago) |
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I mean controls as in, individuals without recent coronary problems.
All you could possibly say from this is poly's could be a problem if you have had problems.
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King Koopa said:
The amount of pot that Gask smokes is equivalent to a guy shooting heroin on weekends
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TomCollins
Registered: 10/06/09
Posts: 2,943
Last seen: 11 months, 12 days
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Re: Another glorious victory against vegans! [Re: drawde]
#657919 - 02/07/13 03:02 PM (11 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
drawde said:
For the affluent
I love debating...
Apparently the real cost behind en vitro meat is the nutrient soup they have to grow the meat in, BUT....
Quote:
Commercial: The growth medium should be inexpensive to produce.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/In_vitro_meat#cite_note-discovery_2008-28
Also, according to this article http://discovermagazine.com/2008/oct/22-ill-have-my-burger-petri-dish-bred#.URQj3KXC1zA
The new plant based growth mediums they're working on will be vegan compliant! So you can eat it meat in the future too with your hippy friends!
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andyistic said:
Ok so let me bring you idiots up to speed.
The admins are tired of this shitfest being made the joke of the weed community on the Internet.
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TomCollins
Registered: 10/06/09
Posts: 2,943
Last seen: 11 months, 12 days
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Re: Another glorious victory against vegans! [Re: drawde]
#657922 - 02/07/13 03:04 PM (11 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
drawde said:
I mean controls as in, individuals without recent coronary problems.
All you could possibly say from this is poly's could be a problem if you have had problems.
It's a cohort. They selected 458 men with events, there were many people without events in the study.
You can't study heart disease on people who don't get it. lol.
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andyistic said:
Ok so let me bring you idiots up to speed.
The admins are tired of this shitfest being made the joke of the weed community on the Internet.
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Stoneth
D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.
Registered: 10/06/08
Posts: 25,048
Loc: No where ville, USA 
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Re: Another glorious victory against vegans! [Re: Magash]
#657923 - 02/07/13 03:04 PM (11 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
Magash said:
Here we go on this stupid argument again on which diet is the best I see it coming.
It's as simple as this. We live in America folks (most of us here do anyway) the rule here is, it doesn't matter what you eat as long as you eat to much of it.
 
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GreenHorns
boulevardier
Registered: 01/10/13
Posts: 1,195
Loc: funkytown
Last seen: 4 years, 6 months
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Re: Another glorious victory against vegans! [Re: TomCollins]
#657933 - 02/07/13 03:35 PM (11 years, 9 months ago) |
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i read this as "intravenous" and got images of someone mainlining bacon drippings.
Quote:
Spency said:
Quote:
Methods: Interventions Replacement of dietary saturated fats
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wiggy wham wham wazzle
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drawde
Registered: 11/15/09
Posts: 5,268
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Re: Another glorious victory against vegans! [Re: TomCollins]
#657935 - 02/07/13 03:50 PM (11 years, 9 months ago) |
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What really gets me here spencer is your attitude. This is a meta-analysis of 458 people studied in the 70s. Some glorious victory. 
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King Koopa said:
The amount of pot that Gask smokes is equivalent to a guy shooting heroin on weekends
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Deadkndys420
Registered: 08/28/12
Posts: 8,703
Loc: █████
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Re: Another glorious victory against vegans! [Re: drawde]
#657942 - 02/07/13 04:10 PM (11 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
drawde said:
By choosing not to consume animal products
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drawde
Registered: 11/15/09
Posts: 5,268
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Re: Another glorious victory against vegans! [Re: Deadkndys420]
#657944 - 02/07/13 04:21 PM (11 years, 9 months ago) |
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We are discussing diet not lifestyle. Diet is entirely possible.
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King Koopa said:
The amount of pot that Gask smokes is equivalent to a guy shooting heroin on weekends
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GreenHorns
boulevardier
Registered: 01/10/13
Posts: 1,195
Loc: funkytown
Last seen: 4 years, 6 months
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Re: Another glorious victory against vegans! [Re: drawde]
#657947 - 02/07/13 04:35 PM (11 years, 9 months ago) |
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thats a funny pic none the less.
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wiggy wham wham wazzle
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