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 Lotsae
Registered: 04/10/09
Posts: 50
Last seen: 6 years, 20 days
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 I get this def. EVERY time... VERY frustrating! 
#391152 - 03/28/10 01:57 PM (14 years, 7 months ago) |
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I am generally a newb with this being only my 4th crop, but EVERY time I start to flower the plants, this same exact deficiency rears its ugly head.
I thought I had it pinned to either P or K because I had a similar problem during veg and I bought some GH KoolBloom (0-10-10), and it seemed to fix it. However, when I switched to flowering this happened again. I am even adding the KoolBloom EVERY watering, and they're still fading.
The most affected leaves are neither at the tom nor bottom, but rather, in the middle of the plants.
Could it be that I am feeding TOO MUCH? I feed every watering which is about every 3-4 days.
Or is it possible that mites are causing this? I see no actual mites but there are small deposits on the bottom of the leaves that look similar to salt. Also, there are no webs around the leaves like with what happened the last time I had mites.
Any help at all is GREATLY appreciated.
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 Hawksresurrection
Registered: 12/04/08
Posts: 13,464
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Re: I get this def. EVERY time... VERY frustrating! [Re: Lotsae]
#391170 - 03/28/10 02:31 PM (14 years, 7 months ago) |
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It does look a little like mite damage to me. Can you get me some more pictures of the undersides of more leaves?
But it also doesn't look like that's the only problem that your dealing with, if you do have a mite issue. How big are the containers your plant's are growing in? Have you flushed at all?? If your feeding at every watering you could be dealing with a toxic salt build up. Or just a nutrient toxicity.
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Dude she isn't as young as she use to be.
-niteowl
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wishcouldeletethis
Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 675
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Re: I get this def. EVERY time... VERY frustrating! *DELETED* [Re: Lotsae]
#391183 - 03/28/10 02:38 PM (14 years, 7 months ago) |
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Post deleted by lampshadehelmetReason for deletion: k
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Hawksresurrection
Registered: 12/04/08
Posts: 13,464
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Re: I get this def. EVERY time... VERY frustrating! [Re: wishcouldeletethis]
#391206 - 03/28/10 02:53 PM (14 years, 7 months ago) |
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Nah, you can get rid of mites entirely with a repeating dose of pyrethrum bombs. One a week for 3 weeks. Just make sure that all electrical equipment is unplugged and off before activating them.
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Dude she isn't as young as she use to be.
-niteowl
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Lotsae
Registered: 04/10/09
Posts: 50
Last seen: 6 years, 20 days
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Re: I get this def. EVERY time... VERY frustrating! [Re: Hawksresurrection]
#391235 - 03/28/10 03:24 PM (14 years, 7 months ago) |
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Here ya go..
So what you're thinking is that the symptoms of the salt buildup gives the mites a weak part of the plant to exploit and that's what I'm seeing?
I'm using Flora Nova Bloom (every watering), GH KoolBloom (every watering), GH Diamond Nectar (every watering), General Organics CaMg+ (every 2 wks), Earth Juice Microblast (every watering), SaferGro Manganese (every 4 wks). And then SaferGro organic pH down when needed.
I'm not good with the camera, especiialy with the Macro on. So if you need anymore pics let me know and I'll get them up right away.
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Hawksresurrection
Registered: 12/04/08
Posts: 13,464
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Re: I get this def. EVERY time... VERY frustrating! [Re: Lotsae]
#391335 - 03/28/10 04:52 PM (14 years, 7 months ago) |
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You definitely have mites man.
How long into flowering are you?
I ask because that's going to determine what you can use to take care of the mite problem. Now when it comes to the nutrient issue. I think you need to start off by flushing your medium. You should flush at least 3 times the amount of soil your in. So if you have 5 gallons of soil your going to have to run at least 15 gallons of water through it. If you can get a product like clearex that would be your best bet. If not a VERY light nutrient solution will work better than plain water at flushing the built up salts out of your medium. After that resume your feeding at the next watering, but don't feed with every watering you do. At least ever yother time at most.
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Dude she isn't as young as she use to be.
-niteowl
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wishcouldeletethis
Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 675
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Re: I get this def. EVERY time... VERY frustrating! *DELETED* [Re: Lotsae]
#391412 - 03/28/10 05:45 PM (14 years, 7 months ago) |
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Post deleted by lampshadehelmetReason for deletion: k
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Lotsae
Registered: 04/10/09
Posts: 50
Last seen: 6 years, 20 days
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Re: I get this def. EVERY time... VERY frustrating! [Re: Hawksresurrection]
#391425 - 03/28/10 05:53 PM (14 years, 7 months ago) |
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Awesome, thanks guys! I am only a week into flower.
I'm safe to use Neem oil then, right? Isn't Neem oil safe to use up until two weeks before harvest?
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Harry_Ba11sach
cannoisseur
Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 11,753
Loc: Nepal 
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Re: I get this def. EVERY time... VERY frustrating! [Re: Lotsae]
#391626 - 03/28/10 07:49 PM (14 years, 7 months ago) |
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here's what I found to be a nice non-toxic mite killer. plus, not a chemical so there's no possible way for them to acquire immunity to it.
- Buy some diatomaceous earth
- Rub all over plant leaves. I'm talking EVERYWHERE
- Watch the little bastards all die within the next week
- ????
- Profit
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wishcouldeletethis
Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 675
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Re: I get this def. EVERY time... VERY frustrating! *DELETED* [Re: Harry_Ba11sach]
#391661 - 03/28/10 08:14 PM (14 years, 7 months ago) |
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Post deleted by lampshadehelmetReason for deletion: k
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Harry_Ba11sach
cannoisseur
Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 11,753
Loc: Nepal
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Re: I get this def. EVERY time... VERY frustrating! [Re: wishcouldeletethis]
#391668 - 03/28/10 08:16 PM (14 years, 7 months ago) |
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Yep, D-Earth is completely safe for humans and plants. in fact, you can even get "food-grade" stuff which is even safe to eat 
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wishcouldeletethis
Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 675
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Re: I get this def. EVERY time... VERY frustrating! *DELETED* [Re: Harry_Ba11sach]
#391688 - 03/28/10 08:24 PM (14 years, 7 months ago) |
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Post deleted by lampshadehelmetReason for deletion: k
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Harry_Ba11sach
cannoisseur
Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 11,753
Loc: Nepal
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Re: I get this def. EVERY time... VERY frustrating! [Re: wishcouldeletethis]
#391698 - 03/28/10 08:27 PM (14 years, 7 months ago) |
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yeah, the gnats is where I started to use it, but I found out that it works just as well for mites 
Had some winged root-aphids a couple weeks ago, knocked those fuckers out in 3 days by just sprinkling diatomaceous earth all over my medium
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moogles
Registered: 09/23/09
Posts: 196
Last seen: 13 years, 2 months
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Re: I get this def. EVERY time... VERY frustrating! [Re: Harry_Ba11sach]
#391948 - 03/28/10 11:12 PM (14 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
Harry_Ba11sach said:
Yep, D-Earth is completely safe for humans and plants. in fact, you can even get "food-grade" stuff which is even safe to eat
Be sure to get the food grade
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TomCollins
Registered: 10/06/09
Posts: 2,943
Last seen: 10 months, 25 days
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Re: I get this def. EVERY time... VERY frustrating! [Re: wishcouldeletethis]
#392088 - 03/29/10 12:40 PM (14 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
lampshadehelmet said:
The white stuff on the underside of leaves are mites/eggs/ and shit. Pyrethrum will not kill all mites and is far more toxic than neem oil. Mites quickly gain immunity to pesticides and that is why they are so hard to get rid off.
My understanding is that Natural Pyrethrum is apparently not toxic for humans and it supposedly breaks down extremely quickly when exposed to light. Therefore, it would seem that natural pyrethrum is not a terrible option if your in flowering.
I have used pyrethrum to combat mites and I think it's effective. I have also used it within two weeks of harvest - the smoke was good and I didn't die or get sick. I smoked a lot too.
I was discouraged from trying neem oil because I read somewhere around here it really stresses out your plants and it makes your bud taste like dick.
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andyistic said:
Ok so let me bring you idiots up to speed.
The admins are tired of this shitfest being made the joke of the weed community on the Internet.
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wishcouldeletethis
Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 675
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Re: I get this def. EVERY time... VERY frustrating! *DELETED* [Re: TomCollins]
#392137 - 03/29/10 02:43 PM (14 years, 7 months ago) |
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Post deleted by lampshadehelmetReason for deletion: k
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Lotsae
Registered: 04/10/09
Posts: 50
Last seen: 6 years, 20 days
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Re: I get this def. EVERY time... VERY frustrating! [Re: wishcouldeletethis]
#392169 - 03/29/10 03:27 PM (14 years, 7 months ago) |
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Sweet, I got a considerable amount of DE from my myco-endeavors. I love owning multi-purpose products. I think I'll do both.
Flushing all those girls was a huge pain in the ass. Guess it's worth it, though...
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Lotsae
Registered: 04/10/09
Posts: 50
Last seen: 6 years, 20 days
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Re: I get this def. EVERY time... VERY frustrating! [Re: Lotsae]
#392380 - 03/29/10 08:01 PM (14 years, 7 months ago) |
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Also, how fast should these girls respond to the treatment? I sprayed pretty heavily and flushed like a mad man with Final Flush/water solution.
However, they seem like they're still getting worse. How long should I wait after the flush to commence feeding again.
Also, would mychorrizal and bacillus inoculant such as Great White combat mites in the dirt? I'm going to use it either way, but it seems like bacillus would kill the bugs and the mychorrizae would protect the roots from moderate salt buildup.
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wishcouldeletethis
Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 675
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Re: I get this def. EVERY time... VERY frustrating! *DELETED* [Re: Lotsae]
#392531 - 03/29/10 11:23 PM (14 years, 7 months ago) |
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Post deleted by lampshadehelmetReason for deletion: k
Edited by wishcouldeletethis (03/29/10 11:30 PM)
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Lotsae
Registered: 04/10/09
Posts: 50
Last seen: 6 years, 20 days
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Re: I get this def. EVERY time... VERY frustrating! [Re: wishcouldeletethis]
#392740 - 03/30/10 01:52 PM (14 years, 7 months ago) |
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I highly doubt that I'm underwatering them. Especially now with them just recently getting flushed.
I have them in 2 gal. bags and am doing SOG from clones that I let veg 1 week after transplanting to soil and then switched to 12/12.
Part of the problem with half the plants could just be that they're Blueberry strain and are a bitch to grow, anyways...
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Blackstatis
Stranger
Registered: 02/28/10
Posts: 129
Last seen: 11 years, 2 months
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Re: I get this def. EVERY time... VERY frustrating! [Re: Lotsae]
#392993 - 03/30/10 09:20 PM (14 years, 7 months ago) |
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i have this exact same problem. went to the grow store today and talked to they guy a little about this. he told me that what would really get them bastards is "nematodes", which normally are a bad thing, but apparently there is a strain of them used for plant soils. he said they eat the larvae and any other bugs in the dirt and then when the foods gone, they die.
however... what i'm wondering is; babies can't bread babies, right? so if i use the DE all over my plant and on the top of my soil, i'll be able to kill the adults which would otherwise create more babies.
if you are still checking this...
dear harry ballsach,
have you ridded these pests completely from grows and seen improvement in leaf development by only using DE?
Your peer,
black
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Harry_Ba11sach
cannoisseur
Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 11,753
Loc: Nepal
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Re: I get this def. EVERY time... VERY frustrating! [Re: Blackstatis]
#393007 - 03/30/10 09:37 PM (14 years, 7 months ago) |
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Dear Black,
This is my first time using DE to attack mites, but only a week after first application I can say that the results look very promising so far
Love,
Pube-Covered Scrotum
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Hawksresurrection
Registered: 12/04/08
Posts: 13,464
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Re: I get this def. EVERY time... VERY frustrating! [Re: wishcouldeletethis]
#393079 - 03/31/10 02:20 AM (14 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
lampshadehelmet said:
The white stuff on the underside of leaves are mites/eggs/ and shit. Pyrethrum will not kill all mites and is far more toxic than neem oil. Mites quickly gain immunity to pesticides and that is why they are so hard to get rid off.
The bombs may work for a while but eventually they will not be so effective. Using neem during flowering up until the final two weeks even is alright as you can give them a good rinse with water towards the end. With regular use of neem during veg, populations should be low enough so you do not have a problem during flowering.
The advantage of neem is that the actual act of spraying plants with water reduces the numbers of mites and keeps populations lower as well. Most mite problems get out of hand when the air is too arid and the plants are actually under watered.
Get the mites under control, cut back on nutes a bit and then focus on the yellowing of leaves once things have calmed a bit.
Sorry I haven't been on in a few days, there are a number of issues through this post I would like to address.
First, Neem Oil is in NO way more effective than pyrethroids, PERIOD. Pyrethrum is an insecticide, Ne em oil had no definitive definition, they claim is treats all sorts of crap that I have seen it fail at time and again.
Sure, any living thing can gain resistances to any type of substance. Bacteria gains resistance to anti-biotics, fungi evolve and end up getting resistance to fungicides, humans become addicted to substances and need more of them to get high, insects gain resistance to insecticides because they are used in-properly. Just like all the other substances mentioned. Pyrethriods are far more effective than neem oil in controlling mite problems. The only issue is you can't use them during flowering. But if used properly you wont have issues during flowering.
Now, if I had a mite problem during flowering what would I use. I would use neither. I prefer not to put ANY type of chemical on my plants in flowering, whether they call it a natural oil or not. I would put predator mites on my plants if I was having problems during flowering. They are reasonably priced and can be obtained at any decent hydro shop.
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Dude she isn't as young as she use to be.
-niteowl
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Harry_Ba11sach
cannoisseur
Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 11,753
Loc: Nepal
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Re: I get this def. EVERY time... VERY frustrating! [Re: Hawksresurrection]
#393107 - 03/31/10 08:02 AM (14 years, 7 months ago) |
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but predator mites are only useful if you can maintain humidity levels >60% right? I've been told many times that they're useless out here unless I have a humidifier because colorado is extremely dry naturally. Even during peak flowering in a packed room I never exceed 30% RH
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Lotsae
Registered: 04/10/09
Posts: 50
Last seen: 6 years, 20 days
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Re: I get this def. EVERY time... VERY frustrating! [Re: Hawksresurrection]
#393702 - 04/01/10 11:28 AM (14 years, 7 months ago) |
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Great, I'll get some nematodes this weekend. I've heard of them before but forgot all about it. However, I did inoculate the roots with Great White which has multiple species of mychorrizae, bacillus, trichoderma. It's scary as hell using that stuff with my mushrooms being in the same room. Every little drop of dust that hit the floor received a healthy alcohol bath, on the house.
Meanwhile, all the grit is gone off of the bottom of my leaves, but I'm still getting leaves going bad. It's mainly just fan leaves on these plants (the pics attached are of these).
I HEAVILY flushed all the 2gal bags with final flush so toxicity should be ruled out, correct? There seems to be more than on problem, as well. Anyways, here's the pics:
Here's the first of what I think are the same issues.
Here's the next set of issues. For the first pic, Notice the box I drew in the upper right corner, as well as the rest of the leaf.
And this leaf also seems to have a different type of problem.
Overview and PPM.
But also, I have my mothers a remote location (indoors), and all the fan leaves are dropping off one by one from the bottom up. Is there a def./toxicity that causes this? THey had mites, as well, but the mites are gone and the fan leaves are just dropping like flies with none of the other leaves really showing any symptoms.
I can't believe I'm having such a hard time growing a weed!!! 
Edited by Lotsae (04/01/10 11:30 AM)
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Harry_Ba11sach
cannoisseur
Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 11,753
Loc: Nepal
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Re: I get this def. EVERY time... VERY frustrating! [Re: Lotsae]
#393779 - 04/01/10 01:15 PM (14 years, 7 months ago) |
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Is that your CO2 ppm or nutrient solution ppm there? Also what strength light are you running?
The leaves that were damaged previously won't recover, and the plant will most likely just shed them for the sake of conserving energy. Don't be alarmed if those leaves continue to get worse, but pay attention to the new growth and if previously healthy leaves continue to get sick.
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Lotsae
Registered: 04/10/09
Posts: 50
Last seen: 6 years, 20 days
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Re: I get this def. EVERY time... VERY frustrating! [Re: Harry_Ba11sach]
#393795 - 04/01/10 01:29 PM (14 years, 7 months ago) |
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That's my CO2 ppm.
And I'm using a 600w digital bllast with a 600w EYE Hortilux Super HPS bulb.
So should I just go ahead rip off the damaged leaves? Can you tell by looking at the leaves what type of def. it is?
Also, I would like to thank everyone for their help thus far. I really do appreciate it.
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Harry_Ba11sach
cannoisseur
Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 11,753
Loc: Nepal
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Re: I get this def. EVERY time... VERY frustrating! [Re: Lotsae]
#393804 - 04/01/10 01:35 PM (14 years, 7 months ago) |
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I don't think it's a deficiency, I think that's just hella hella mite damage. Just for the record though, CO2 is useless unless you've got at least double that amount of light, high temps, and heavy feedings. I'm assuming that's about a 4x4 tent you're working in judging by the size of that fan?
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Magash
The Feminizer
Registered: 04/21/08
Posts: 6,634
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Re: I get this def. EVERY time... VERY frustrating! [Re: Harry_Ba11sach]
#393905 - 04/01/10 03:49 PM (14 years, 7 months ago) |
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There is product called AVID which will get rid of the mites in one dose. The leaves show signs of overfeeding also.
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All creatures tremble when faced with violence. All creatures fear death, all love life. If we can only see ourselves in others, then how could we possibly hurt another creature?
 Join us at the Growery!
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Lotsae
Registered: 04/10/09
Posts: 50
Last seen: 6 years, 20 days
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Re: I get this def. EVERY time... VERY frustrating! [Re: Magash]
#394139 - 04/01/10 07:52 PM (14 years, 7 months ago) |
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Awesome, thanks Magash.
My tent is 5x5, and it stays at about 81F in there. But you're telling me I spent all that money on CO2 and I won't get any improved results?
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Magash
The Feminizer
Registered: 04/21/08
Posts: 6,634
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Re: I get this def. EVERY time... VERY frustrating! [Re: Lotsae]
#394184 - 04/01/10 08:45 PM (14 years, 7 months ago) |
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Unless that tent is airtight you won't see much. Having improved airflow is much better then adding co2. Every major seed dealer has gone form co2 t improved airflow for their grows now also. I myself have tons of co2 equipment just sitting around I myself have scrapped using it for improvements on airflow and venting.
The only time I see using it is for people that have sealed systems and use air conditioning to cool the grow and remove humidity. 
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All creatures tremble when faced with violence. All creatures fear death, all love life. If we can only see ourselves in others, then how could we possibly hurt another creature?
Join us at the Growery!
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Lotsae
Registered: 04/10/09
Posts: 50
Last seen: 6 years, 20 days
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Re: I get this def. EVERY time... VERY frustrating! [Re: Magash]
#394254 - 04/01/10 10:20 PM (14 years, 7 months ago) |
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It's not airtight, but it's close. That sucks. Will keeping it in there HURT anything? I've spent to much money on the equip and don't have the heart to remove unless it is actually hurting them... Shitty...
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Hawksresurrection
Registered: 12/04/08
Posts: 13,464
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Re: I get this def. EVERY time... VERY frustrating! [Re: Lotsae]
#396818 - 04/05/10 11:59 PM (14 years, 7 months ago) |
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Hell no it wont hurt anything. If your not having a large of amount of constant air flow then co2 supplementation is just fine and will be beneficial to your grow. Get the PPM level to around 2500-3500 tough.
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Dude she isn't as young as she use to be.
-niteowl
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Lotsae
Registered: 04/10/09
Posts: 50
Last seen: 6 years, 20 days
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Re: I get this def. EVERY time... VERY frustrating! [Re: Hawksresurrection]
#397106 - 04/06/10 02:32 PM (14 years, 7 months ago) |
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EDIT: BAH, read the post wrong.
Edited by Lotsae (04/06/10 07:42 PM)
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b0b gnarley
Registered: 04/21/08
Posts: 5,663
Last seen: 13 years, 6 months
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Re: I get this def. EVERY time... VERY frustrating! [Re: Harry_Ba11sach]
#399095 - 04/09/10 09:56 PM (14 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
Harry_Ba11sach said:
here's what I found to be a nice non-toxic mite killer. plus, not a chemical so there's no possible way for them to acquire immunity to it.
- Buy some diatomaceous earth
- Rub all over plant leaves. I'm talking EVERYWHERE
- Watch the little bastards all die within the next week
- ????
- Profit
agreed or introduce a natural predator
cheap and effective
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boomsaway
Registered: 04/25/09
Posts: 95
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Re: I get this def. EVERY time... VERY frustrating! [Re: b0b gnarley]
#408536 - 04/28/10 09:44 PM (14 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Harry_Ba11sach said:
- ????
- Profit
LMAO!!!!
sry i just was running thru the forum and fell off my couch...
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keepITLegalFellas
airo trials
Registered: 10/12/10
Posts: 27
Last seen: 13 years, 9 months
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Re: I get this def. EVERY time... VERY frustrating! [Re: Lotsae]
#501122 - 11/27/10 07:46 AM (13 years, 11 months ago) |
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When I started growing indoor, I couldnt believe how much water 6 mature flowering plants can use.
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I do not condone or condemn. This is my disclaimer, as all my post are complete fiction. Furthurmore any reason for lurking here is swim's and does not concern me.
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